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Commander Rotal finally got decorative blocks!

Discussion in 'General' started by Commander Rotal, Apr 10, 2019.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,975
    Hello there! Been a while.

    So i was sitting there, playing some WoW, yes, it hurts *my* head too, when along came Keen and released... a thing. And it went down like a fart in church.

    Nevermind that. This thread isn't about the Whys, Ifs or Buts of adding paid DLC riiiiight after release; i haven't checked but i'm just gonna go ahead and assume there's an iso-ton of... feedback posts happening already. We don't need my oppinion on that, and since *my* oppinion on that is fairly positive i also don't really want to take part :woot: i don't need an internet backdraft.

    So yeah, paid decorative blocks dlc. While the timing could not possibly have been worse i HAVE asked for pretty much this since the Alpha days. As far as my own personal feelings are concerned it would be both hypocritical and stupid of *me* to complain about getting what i wanted; so i won't. MY main concern here is to take a look at what we're actually getting provided we buy into the DLC. (Which, of course, i already have.)


    1.) My Goddamn Toilet

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Long, LONG have i used the lack of something as basic a utility block as a toilet to point out the sillyness of working on certain blocks (*cough* Wind Chimes!) that we already have before giving poor Treebeard a way to... lighten his load, so to speak. Obviously while there's some tongue and there's some cheek there but when it comes to making your crew quarters nice and cozy... you can't. Not without small blocks, or mods, or supergridding, or Rotor Tricks, or all of the above.
    So Rotal finally got her toilet. Does she like it / them? Well, yes! Aaaaand... no.
    Let me elaborate.

    I admit, my first reaction to seeing the NASA-style vacuum pooper was a smile and thinking to myself "Well played, Keen, well played", because... frankly it feels like good-natured trolling to me. We have Gravity Generators. We have Planets that don't need those. And we got two blocks out of it. Why, exactly, are they giving us super highly realistic
    toilet seats... when we can't even take the suits off? I suppose i get the thinking behind this but when i asked for a toilet block i expected something a little more... toilet-shaped?
    Especially considering that they're giving us TWO blocks for the toilet alone - there would have been ample room to keep the boxed one the way it is and make the standalone a variant of the Passenger Seat for a design aestetic that's a little less NASA and a little more SE. Mind you, i DO like that we have one now - two, in fact - and i enjoy the models for what they are supposed to be. I've said it many times in the past: "Keen, give me ONE Toilet Block and let the modders do variations of it." No, i'm not a super-huge fan of the design they went with, but i have a "vanilla" Toilet Block now. It's a compromise i can live with.

    Haaaaaaaaaving said that.

    The boxed Toilet Block is a fine example of two problems i have with more or less most / the entire set of DLC blocks. Three, if we count the fact that, frankly, none of them look like they're vanilla Space Engineers blocks.

    Problem Number 1 is limited to the boxed blocks, so the Toilet, the Bed, the Armoryx. It's just... put this in an existing ship within vanilla SE and it just looks really out of place in the way they take up space. No other block in Vanilla does that, not even the damn Medical ROOM. The closest it gets is the Sliding Door, which, ironically, is a block i would personally NOT want to use in combination with the TOILET Block:

    [​IMG]

    (Incidentally, why doesn't the Toilet Block come with it's own Door? Part of the entire POINT behind wanting these kinds of blocks is to save on space inside the quarters - but unless i want my crew to poop out in the open i have to waste an entire grid cube on the door anyway.)

    Problem Number 2 concerns the coloring. Not the pink; i just like pink. But it's VERY pink. This is a problem i'm having with ALL of the DLC blocks: they are all VERY low on different colorings. Paint it pink? Most of the block is now an indifferent shade of pink. Color it white? It's practically all white. Throw some green on it? 's all green. The DLC blocks could all do with another pass. Let's take the Toilet Seat as an example: with a pink coloring the toilet seat itself, the little sucker cup, the inlay underneath both - all of these could do with some colorings, like metallic silver for the buttholder. The way they're done *right now* honestly reminds me more of an unfinished product than "paid DLC" material. The Toilet Block is even worse as all the instruments and boxes and EVERYTHING in that little room just takes on the same pink color of the block coloring and turns it into a pink mess with no contrast; the toilet kind of slips back into the background.
    To give you a better example of what i mean let me show you the Medical ROOM (*facepalms*) in the same pink coloring:

    [​IMG]

    Notice how wast areas of the front come in different shades of grey and or brown (yes, still colorblind), with yellow bits here and there, and frankly the back has even more colorful greebly bits. Now compare the colors of the details on the Medical Room to the details of the Toilet Block. Am i getting my point across?

    As a side note: this isn't really a COMPLAINT so much as an unfortunate lost opportunity; i feel like they could have done more with the Toilet Block and turn it into a Bathroom Block. There's so much room in there they could have made it a smaller, more regular toilet seat plus a shower (maybe combine them) and add a sink for less NASA-style designs; especially if they had just gone ahead and made it a 2x1x1 block to add a door.


    2.) Desk and Desk Corner


    [​IMG]

    I don't have much to complain about these; i like them, i enjoy them, i will use them, i just think they could have done more with the concept.
    First of all: they look NOTHING like the vanilla Seat model... and THANK GODDESS for that because i'm sick of the molten banana peal chairs. ... but now they clash with Passenger Seats, Flights Seats and Control Stations. What's the point of having a standardized design when it's not coherent? (translation: change the old seats to use these ones! :p )
    Secondly: it's a damn shame that the desks don't have any features. There's so many variations they could have done; just adding the existing Small Grid Programmable Block to it on one side, or a Button Panel, or a small LCD screen, or Visual Inventory ME-style, a version with knife, fork and plate, or some bags of astronaut food if they insist on the NASA-route. Like. It's an empty table. I'm HAPPY i have an empty table. But if they're charging for it as part of a DECORATIVE BLOCKS DLC i do believe they could (and should) have done more than the absolute basic minimum. The Desk Block, as is, is something i'd have expected as part of the base game. And i say that as someone who's very much in FAVOUR of paid decorative DLC.

    Incidentally: where's the Small Grid version? And don't tell me it's for performance reasons - i'll let you get away with the shitter not being available but we DO have Small Grid Passenger Seats. I call no no on that one.


    3.) The Couch

    [​IMG]

    Oh. Oh, i like the Couch Block. I love it. The only gripe i have with it is that it seems like it only lets one Engineer sit down at a time. That's a damn shame.


    4.) Console Block

    [​IMG]

    Now... i DO believe that the base version of this block is a little on the one-color-ish side of the problem described above in the Toilet-section of this post, but... let's be honest, with the Console we're not really giving a shit about the BLOCK.

    [​IMG]

    I mean, what even do we say about that. Add a way to have the projection rotate without having to use a Rotor and this is a dream come true. Not necessarily MY dream but hey, *I* am building my own Starfleet Museum now. I'm happy.

    Also: in case anyone was wondering why i didn't complain about the lack of a proper, bigger table with the Desk Block, this is why. I can bastardize the Console Block for that.

    Side Note: We're, uh, we're gonna operate under the assumption that the Console Block will WORK in the future:

    [​IMG]

    This is supposed to be the blueprint of my Imperial Stardestroyer.
    This does not look like an Imperial Stardestroyer.
    I used the damn thing for TWO MINUTES to get a nice lolzy screenshot for this post. Aaaand it broke while doing that.
    For reference: this is what the blueprint looks like when loaded correctly:

    [​IMG]


    5.) Armory and Armory Locker

    [​IMG]

    I loved this block already when it was a mod (*cough*) so naturally i enjoy seeing it vanilla SE to add right next to am Airlock or something; sadly this is a case where i see a lot of downsides contrasting good ideas.
    Good stuff first: i love what they did with the suit parts, tools and rifles; that's the kind of fluffy additions i was talking about in the Desk's section. I DO wish i could choose what goes where but hey, it's SOMETHING.
    The bad stuff though. Well. I think the top and bottom areas could do with more greeblies (i enjoy the middle section, for what it's worth, especially the Welders brightening up the their spot), the enclosed Room just looks weird in Space Engineers and the Armory Locker continues the proud tradition of the Medical ROOM, yes, Medical ROOM, i will NOT let that one live down Keen, proud tradition of only comming in one orientation and no mirrored version. Speaking of...

    [​IMG]

    ... yeeeah we might need to work out the kinks in Mirror Mode.


    6.) The Lockers

    [​IMG]

    Oh boy.
    So, i like the concept here. Not sure if i necessarily would have pushed for this instead of a bulkier cupboard block or something but, you know, this is fine. I like this. I enjoy this.
    ...
    But it's all one color. Like. The little access hatches here could all do with more accents, especially around the rims, and that roll-door just ASKS to be brown, silver or grey. SOMETHING to get some excitement in here. The visibility here is absolutely terrible, especially when you compare it to the vanilla Conveyor Port-library piece. It looks UNFINISHED is what i'm saying.
    Look at this.

    [​IMG]

    I consider this a problem. It's too undifferentiatedly pink. (Or white, or grey, or duckegg blue, you get what i'm saying. I think.)

    Oh, and while we're on the topic of "Problems".
    Why. WHY. W H Y can i not change my suit and character model (or at least just the suit) at the
    L
    O
    C
    K
    E
    R

    Block? I mean that just kinda seems like a no brainer.


    7.) The Kitchen

    [​IMG]

    See, this is actually kind of what i'm talking about; i sort of wish the drawers had a additional dash of coloring somewhere but all in all i really enjoy what i'm seeing here. And to put the little dig at the Conveypor Port above into perspective...

    [​IMG]

    That's my point. Not only is it the only part of the entire block that actually reminds me of Space Engineers' questionable visual design choices, it also sticks out. It's unmissable. It adds some flavour and diversity to the block where it would otherwise just have an empty area (looking at you, Desk Block). I feel like they could have added more kitchen-themed blocks, like a less Away Team-y version of the Lockers, but overall i love the Kitchen as it is.


    8.) The Planter

    [​IMG]

    I... i *want* to like it. I do. Trust me. But it's so... bland and boring and dark. Brightening up the actual block's color helps but the dark glass and the dark, generic plants inside just suck all the joy out of it. There's a real missed opportunity here to let us choose what kind of salad we want to display (or display something else! I could see some colorful ore chunks working nicely here). Of all the blocks in the DLC pack this is prooobably the one i like the least. Truth be told, i'd go as far as to say i hate it. (Honorary mention goes to the Planter's butt-side because the greeblies there are pretty nice; a shame we only got one version of the block that is offset to the back of the grid block.)


    9.) The Bed

    [​IMG]

    Saving the weirdest addition of the pack for last i present you the.... Bed (?) Block.
    I suppose i'll let them get away with the weird NASA-style on the grounds that the Couch can serve as a stand-in for a proper bed but let's be honest, this thing just looks weird on it's own and when placed planetside it's just ridicioulous. I've seen Borg Assimilation Stations more cozy than this thing. And WHAT THE HELL Keen, what the shit is up with the WALL and ceiling? WHY does my BED Block come with a WINDOW? And WHY is that Wall With Window not available as a stand alone?

    [​IMG]

    Look at this, THIS IS AWESOME! Why is this not it's own block?


    10.) The, uh, the thing. The one everyone is complaing about.

    [​IMG]

    So, uh... if you don't have an oppinion on the Industrial Cockpits yet, good luck, you'll have one when you keep browsing SE-related channels. *takes a sip* I... don't mind it being in the Decorative DLC pack. In fact this is kind of what i want to see in decorative packages: new blocks AND variants.
    Mind you, that doesn't mean i love the Industrial Cockpits - i don't give a rat's ass about PvP balancing and the tyranny of surviving half a split second longer than a vanilla Cockpit but frankly i think they look like shit and especially the Large Grid one is little more than the regular Cockpit placed upside-down. I don't like them. But i have plenty of other blocks to use for their intended purposes so i don't really feel like making a big fuss about them. I hardly ever use First Person Perspective for ship navigation anyway. But hey, it's there. Maybe i'll find use for them one day.


    So we've looked at all the blocks in the paid Decorative Blocks DLC and my final verdict as someone who has asked for this many, many times is........ *drum rolls*


    It's pretty good. Not awesome, not horrible; lots of missed opportunities and frankly the ideas pooped out by going through the existing DLC blocks has spawned enough ideas for a second one without even comming up with NEW decorative blocks but... yeah. I paid less than 3,50 Euro on it. I'll leave the arguing about paid DLC for decorative blocks to other people; looking at WHAT WE ACTUALLY GOT fairly i see some really good blocks, some mediocre ones and 2 (3 with Small Grid version of the Industrial Cockpit) that i don't like. And tons and tons of improvements to be had. But for the price of less than a good-sized Chicken Burger. The price-value is definitely on point here. But to be blunt i would have preferred to get more blocks, more Small Grid variants and some little touch-ups to the ones we already got and pay a little more for the pack in return. With the one they released you sure get what you pay for... but you're not paying a lot.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
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  2. Roxette Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,383
    This is not normal, your game has missing or corrupt texture files, which always get rendered the bright pink default. I suggest the steam option to verify the game files as a first step, if it persists, examine the log file for clues or post it for assistance :)
     
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  3. Sentinel-Ghost Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    108
    You know Rotal is colour blind right? That's why the blocks are coloured pink. (Edit: Rotal really likes pink!) Its the fact that the whole block is painted whichever colour you choose, with no highlights etc.
    Should be Space Engineers Epitaph. ;)
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
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  4. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,975
    Slight correction; they're not pink because i'm color blind, they're pink because i like pink :D rest of the post is spot on though ^^
     
  5. Lord Grey Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    345
    Hi Rotal,
    When I read your review I had such a dejy-vu feeleing. I don't mind so much the coloring as my space crafts are in the traditionaly white mostly. But I had the same thougts about the gravity generators and the toilets. My opinion on this is, artificial gravity can fail, and you surely don't want to have uncontained water in microgravity along electronical instruments. It'y a problem I already spend a lot of time trying to come up with different solutions under the asumption that A.) The direction of the artifical graviti (AG) is in an angle to the natural gravity (NG) of a planet you land on B.) AG could fail due whatever reason C.) You want to keep unpleasant smells contained. Space Stations smell already unpleasant. (A door and a good ventilation with a industrial gas filter, but mostly the door for privacy). But then you don't await solutions to theoretically space problems for 4$. But I would have liked to get the space shower too.

    I totally agree that I would have liked the window wall of the bed as stansalone. And the beds with sleep bags and belts instead of the rigid restraints. I would also add velcro belts to the desks to keep papers an pens in microgravity, would fit the NASA style.

    With the inventory blocks I regrett that they don't have connection to the conveyor system so you can restock them directly from the assembler, but that's minor. What really disapoints me is that the Workshop Mod 1139587813 of the weapons rack really displays the guns if you place them in it, what Keens version didn't. OK, I get that it would be hard on the preformance, but I still liked it a lot and will prefer the mod to the DLC.
    Oposite to you I would attribute the change of suit design to the armories and not the lockers, they display the suit and tools already.

    To the Kitchen it would have nice to have a table and bench arrangement Cantina-style to fit to it.

    And the cockpits just woke associations with harvester-thresher.

    How true
     
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  6. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    535
    The official space toilet has left everyone flushed with excitement.

    :munch:

    ... I'll see myself to the door...
     
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  7. Stardriver907 Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,997
    Always nice to have you around, Commander.

    You are right about the toilet blocks being good, and bad. I believe what happened is they went NASA style for the toilet itself (hence the stand-alone version) and went full metal jacket military bunker for the full version. So, if you are building a battleship it should fit right in. If you're building something else, they just look weird. Here's the mod that I've used forever and still do today:

    Less "military" and more "institutional", the mod has regular toilets and "space" toilets to choose from. No doors on anything. Modder says he never figured out how to do it. Apparently Keen doesn't know how either, or it's just impossible.

    What I disliked most about the mod that is a plus for the Keen block is that the mod didn't have a door, or a floor, or a ceiling. I hate blocks like that. The best Modders give you versions with and without floors. The best ever Modders give you versions with or without floors and ceilings. It should go without saying that asymmetrical blocks must have a mirrored version.

    The beds look eerily like a passage block laying on its side.

    I don't know, but I guess if you've spent a lot of time using a passage block as a bed, you might end up making a bed that looks like a passage block.

    I've been using bunk bed mods for my crew. They save a lot of space, but only the lower bunk is actually usable. I'm guessing it's impossible to have a functional bunk bed that two people could use at once, and I suspect the same applies for a three-seater couch that only one person can sit on.

    Thing is, I'm glad there is a toilet now and there is a bed now, and a table. It's at least an acknowledgement that many of us value blocks like these to the point that we might (;)) pay for them. I hope it inspires more Modders to make similar blocks in other styles.
     
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  8. Sirhan Blixt Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    455
    Keep a lid on it, buddy.
     
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  9. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,975
    Yeah, noticed that too ingame. It's *weird*.

    Same!
     
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  10. Sentinel-Ghost Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    108
    Just a quick question for those who have the dlc, I haven't bit the bullet and got it just yet.
    Is the 'enclosed' toilet block pressurised? Can it be 'hooked up' to a life support conveyor network like the cockpit?

    I've been doing a ship interior and need to know whether I have to include a cabin like structure around the block with an air-vent etc. I was hoping I could just plonk a door in front and and seal the block in but I don't want crewman to suffocate whilst doing a number 2!
     
  11. May Rears Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    404
    Don't feed them space-bean stew too much then :)
     
  12. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,975
    I haven't tested it but the block itself looks like it's airtight, not counting the front which is open because there's no door. There are no Conveyor ports; it seems to be designed to be used in an already pressurized environment. It's less of a room and more of dip in the wall.

    Edit: [​IMG]

    That's the outside walls / ceiling and identical floor of the shitter block. No *visible* Conveyor Ports, at least.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
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  13. Smokki Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    77
    I actually like the box variants quite a lot, as I like to build... try to build as realistic sized rooms as possible and these can be used very creatively to divide space and use space that would be just wasted by armor blocks.

    Missing a shower was a big hit for me until I found out that the bed placed so that the engineer stands on it makes for a nice shower :p

    What I hope in the future is Keen to create more variants of the same block... for more variety.
     
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  14. FoolishOwl Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    507
    I was a little surprised that the small grid industrial cockpit doesn't have the same dimensions as the existing standard cockpit. I was more surprised that for the conveyor ports to line up with the ports on an oxygen tank or O2/H2 generator, the blocks have to be staggered. That makes placement a bit awkward. It also means that a vehicle that was designed around one cockpit would have to be significantly redesigned to accommodate the other.
     
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  15. Spets Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,209
    I believe if they move the new cockpit to the base game, and add a few variants for the deco blocks, they will reach that hard to achieve mission to have both sides of happy people.


    EDIT: by the way, what happened with this?
    [​IMG]
     
  16. FoolishOwl Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    507
    That makes sense to me, as a sort of retroactive confirmation of the use of passage blocks to represent bunks.
     
  17. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,413
    Gone...like Elvis and his mom.
     
  18. Stardriver907 Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,997
    I generally use one of VCZ,s offset doors (the ones without windows ;)) to close off bathrooms. They sit fairly flush and the "doors" don't end up sticking out somewhere when they're open.
    [​IMG]
    That's the best I've been able to do. Of course, if there's a floor above or below then there will be a hole to cover.
     
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  19. mojomann71 Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,718
    What I did with the DLC blocks on Big Red


    --- Automerge ---
    @FoolishOwl I had no issues piping up my Rock Eater using the new Industrial Cockpit.
     
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  20. Stardriver907 Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,997
    You put an open toilet right inside the front door? I guess you don't want to be the second person to enter the ship ;).
     
  21. mojomann71 Senior Engineer

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    1,718
  22. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,413
    I just let loose on an asterioid. Or just within a planet's gravity well. Bye, bye, little sailor.
     
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  23. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    535
    Now we know what really killed the dinosaurs....
     
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  24. Hazee Daze Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    26
    Nice post! On point, and very funny.
     
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