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Gas giants?

Discussion in 'General' started by Crawller, May 29, 2017.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Crawller Trainee Engineer

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    43
    Today I was playing creative SE to kill time and I spawned a gas giant from
    workshop (this https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=917662028&searchtext=)

    After exploding my ship in half it started to falling into the planet with a lot of debris and when it got too much close the ship entirely explode. It was impressive and at this moment I thinked about how cool would be if Keen add fully supported gas giants to the game, because workshop's gas giants end with a soil surface like rocky planets and have the same max size that the others, without say the clouds layers, etc

    What do you think?

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=935629309
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 3
  2. Forcedminer Senior Engineer

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    2,227
    Death By Gas Giant. Brutal.

    I do love some of the insane planets players have thought up.
    like the black hole...the one with a massive gravitational pull but its a tiny planet with a black atmosphere
     
  3. Crawller Trainee Engineer

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    43
    Yeah
    Die crashing on gas giants is my new drug :woot:

    Its a joke I'm on creative, but the ship explode entirely. You must to test it!! :D

    The black hole is also amazing!
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  4. Wonkatoad Apprentice Engineer

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    200
    I was playing around with the same gas giant for the first time yesterday! Having a killer planet that tears your ship to pieces is definitely a unique idea :p

    Doctor Octoganapus actually has a world you can download that has a 1,000 km wide version of the planet, instead of the usual max 120 km.
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=917662719

    It's worth checking out, but it was causing some minor performance issues with me, so I ended up placing all the planets myself at their vanilla sizes. Under the right circumstances, 120 km can still feel "giant."

    Here's a screenshot I took :)
    [​IMG]
     
    • Like Like x 7
  5. Crawller Trainee Engineer

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    43
    Its looks beautiful!

    KEEN GAS GIANT FOR NEXT MAJOR UPDATE :woot:
     
  6. Echillion Senior Engineer

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    1,334
    Ever since Keen confirmed planets I've been asking for different types like gas giants like Jupiter and Saturn or complete ice worlds like Neptune?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. FoolishOwl Junior Engineer

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    522
    With gas giants, the gas in question is mostly hydrogen. Given a mechanism for gathering hydrogen in large quantities from gas giants, it would make more sense to use it as a fuel source.
    In the old science fiction RPG, Traveller, ships were often outfitted with "fuel scoops" for harvesting hydrogen from gas giants by "skimming". Imagine our ships with fuel scoops, or atmospheric miners that collect hydrogen and store liquid hydrogen in tanks.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  8. Cetric Junior Engineer

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    808
    Oh yes, I imagine a tow line you could unwind which would actually be a collector set on a hose... you would lower that carefully at the rim of a gas planet, trying not to get too close... because then it would catch you and drag you into the gas.... *arghh*
    Nice tense procedure which would require master handling and navigating your equipment and ship. With a reward when you manage the sucking mission => full hydrogen tanks.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. odizzido Junior Engineer

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    672
    I think collecting hydrogen off of gas giants would be very cool. It would also work well with the new hydrogen generator that they're working on.

    edit-------

    Also some of the planets that the gas giant guy made are very cool. I subscribed to a few of them to check them out...the lava one looks the coolest to me so far.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  10. FlakMagnet Senior Engineer

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    1,551
    I have set myself up a starting world with the 1000km gas giant plus another couple of planets in a system. The player start point is a crashed respawn yellow ship, stuck on an asteroid just inside the gas giants gravity well. There is a small amount of uranium to power the reactor...but not enough to fly out of the planets pull...so basically you need to fix it up, find resources, and then you can explore the world. The whole time, that great big green blob is visible in the sky though :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. FoolishOwl Junior Engineer

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    522
    To go into a little more detail, I'm suggesting they add:
    1. Gas "giants" -- probably more or less the same size as existing planets. They'd not have a surface per se, but perhaps below a certain depth the pull of gravity would be difficult to escape, and some point below that, there's a "crush depth" at which any structure would be destroyed by the pressure of the gas. However, it should be reasonable to skim the surface of a gas giant, pass through the upper layers, and collect hydrogen gas. In principle you should be able to have a structure maintain itself in position, via thrusters, indefinitely. Presumably it'd be easiest to just assume the supply of hydrogen is unlimited -- if you can get there, you can take all the hydrogen you can carry.
    2. Fuel scoops -- perhaps based on air vents. These take in ambient hydrogen gas and pass it to tanks or conveyor systems.
    Aside from justifying the hydrogen power generators we've seen in previews, this would give reason to add a few new things to SE, without taking anything out, that would provide some interesting engineering projects to work on.
    Plus, obviously, gas giants should be pretty awesome to look at.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  12. Crawller Trainee Engineer

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    I hope they will add gas giant and a system to get the hydrogen of them
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  13. Deathpuff12 Trainee Engineer

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    2 words: metallic hydrogen.
     
  14. DCam2016 Trainee Engineer

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    That sounds like a really cool scenario :D
     
  15. SpecFrigateBLK3 Senior Engineer

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    1,133
    Love the idea. My first thought was the interesting tactics that a gas giant could enable. Especially if visibility is affected.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Timuroslav Apprentice Engineer

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    173
    Gas Giants would suck you in with their insane gravity, zap you with their ultra powerful lightning and kill your drones with the intense atmospheric interference. :woot:.
    These suggestions sound like Gas dwarves.

    here's what Jupiter sounds like combining all the frequencies of Radio waves.

    It's even killed a couple satellites with that immense Atmospheric static.

    nonetheless, I approve this message.:tu:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. SpecFrigateBLK3 Senior Engineer

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    1,133
    Considering the scale of planets in SE they're all technically dwarf planets. As for the environmental challenges, I wanna bait a space pirate into the grav well and watch all that happen.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  18. Malware Master Engineer

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    9,631
    They're not even dwarf planets, they're spherical asteroids with a superdense core to account for the gravity :p
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  19. SpecFrigateBLK3 Senior Engineer

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    1,133
    If you're gonna get that technical, can you tell me what element would be that dense? Curious minds and all that.
     
  20. odizzido Junior Engineer

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    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutron_star
     
  21. doncdxx Apprentice Engineer

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    413
    If gas giants ever get added, they'll probably add oceans at the same time. The coding needed for gas giants is effectively the same as whats needed for oceans; different altitudes having different physics rules, specific graphics, and the possibility for atmospheric composition that are more than just a boolean value of oxygen or no oxygen.

    It may be more work than Keen wants to do, but I hope they add gas giants, oceans, and just do a complete planet overhaul/upgrade. That and NPC's are my only two hopes for the game.
     
  22. Malware Master Engineer

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    9,631
    I wasn't trying to get technical, I was just commenting on how small the planets actually are, and the fact that they have gravity way beyond their mass... But yeah, @odizzido has a good suggestion :D
     
  23. Soup Toaster Apprentice Engineer

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    196
    Liquids will probably be a huge problem for SE, and it all comes down to the fact that we can build a limitless variety of hollow ships. Say you have a large block submarine, while it's underwater the game will need to calculate the interior volume of the ship and basically subtract that from the water volume. This will get tricky because if the player is standing beside the window the game has to calculate all the visual and physics effects that are occurring on both sides of that window so that both volumes look and function the way they should. Color mapping, gravity, fog effects, sprites (bubbles, random organic floating bits)... there's all kinds of stuff that needs to be kept track of on ships that can be absolutely any shape and size. I think on really large ships that could quickly become a nightmare.

    Of course I could be completely wrong as well. :p
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  24. damoran Junior Engineer

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    608
    Just a thought but could they not just use the same system that currently checks for air volume inside a ship to also apply a post-processing effect (simulating water from the player pov or the camera). There's no volume to it and the effect of being underwater is simply a screen effect applied based on whether or not there is air tightness in the ship.

    As for the floaty bits, they already do this with space dust. The window thing could be tricky but I'm sure there's a way to add an effect to the window textures.
     
  25. Bumber Senior Engineer

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    1,018
    But what does it look like when a water-tight ship is partially submerged? Gases are easier because they don't have defined surfaces.

    I think it would be for best that ships are never water tight. Spacecraft aren't designed to survive high pressure, anyways. You float, or your ship floods/implodes.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2017
  26. Soup Toaster Apprentice Engineer

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    196
    Yeah water brings up all kids of issues, that's not to say that water in SE would be UTTERLY MIND-BLOWINGLY AWESOME. One thing they could do is simply make large block vessels float on the surface, basically large blocks can't penetrate the surface more than 1/3rd the way or something. Then make only small block vessels able to go underwater, with custom blocks. You would have to "flood" the enclosed cockpits with water or make it so players have to use special open cockpits with submersibles. Then all those issues would go away since the there would be only one calculation: is the player above or below the water line? That's been done for more than 20 years at this point....
     
  27. Malware Master Engineer

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    9,631
    Quote from an autoresponse in Discord: "There are no plans to implement (liquid) water of any kind in Space Engineers."
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
  28. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

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    4,828
    In order to implement water, it will have to be able to flow in accordance to gravity. It will have to respond to changes around it... such as voxels being removed. What should happen if water escapes on to the surface? Will it have the power to move blocks/characters when flowing at a sufficient speed?

    It's a whole, big, ugly can of worms to incorporate and the value of it won't mean much for game play... only immersion.
     
  29. damoran Junior Engineer

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    608
    Right, leaving aside the real world differences of space ships and submarines for the sake of gameplay.

    To answer your question, it would depend on where your POV is. If you're viewing the ship from outside camera above the water, you wouldn't see the underwater effect as you would be above the water line. If you rotate you camera so it is under the water's surface it would apply the screen effect of being underwater. Same if you are in FP view. If you left the ship while under the surface it would show the effect. In theory they could even add a depressurization effect (particle?) as the doors open to "pretend" the water was filling the space that was previously air tight. Furthermore, you could reverse the depressurization effect of being blown out of the airlock, instead you would be blown back from water "pretend" rushing in the cabin.

    All in all, I assume it would be a post-processed effect (screen filter), particles simulating water spray when air-tightness is lost, a set of sound effects for everything the player can do underwater and a set of animations for the player.

    Anyway, seems they don't want to bother with it, but I'd be curious to hear a modder's take on something like this.
     
  30. Timuroslav Apprentice Engineer

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    173
    Or you know they could do what has been done in thousands of video games before it, and cheat and simplify mechanics to mimic certain aspects of water. Room pressurized? Yes NO? fill with 'Water'. Thruster in water? Yes No? Yea = no thrust
     
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