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Large scale grinding

Discussion in 'Survival' started by Jurriën van Dongen, Jul 5, 2014.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Jurriën van Dongen Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    33
    After having torn down various vessels as well as a few stations platforms etc. I started to wonder what approach other folks use when it comes to efficient and rapid disassembly (that does not involve the use of high explosives :rolleyes:)

    So far I've tried the following approaches:

    Small ship

    Pro: Cheap to build, agile.

    Con: Grinders on small ships only have 1 large port in the back, and since small conveyors can't handle the bigger ship parts you either need to build a massive conveyor system or equip each grinder with its own medium cargo container which then needs to be unloaded manually.

    Large ship

    Pro: Grinders on large ships have ports on the sides as well, meaning only 1 conveyor/tube/connection per row of grinders is required, making funneling to a single cargo container/connector a breeze.

    Con: With even small thrusters taking up tons of space, and thrusters pointing in every direction being a necessity the ship will turn out far larger and heavier than it needs to be, making it a pain the handle and manoeuvre. When taking thruster damage into account the ship becomes so large it requires more parts than you'll get whatever it is you're actually grinding down.

    Station mounted grinders combined with a small tug

    Pro: Flexible and easy to use, can require some deft piloting though. Recovered parts go straight into the station inventory.

    Con: Larger vessels need to be cut into parts before grinding. Can't be used on stations.


    One thing I haven't tried yet which may be the perfect go-between would be a large ship with the grinders and storage combined with a merge block to hook it up to a small ship that has the cockpit, thrusters etc. An additional advantage would be that said small ship could then do the same with a welding setup.

    I'm curious to hear how other engineers tackle this problem (if they do at all)
     
  2. dzikakulka Trainee Engineer

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    60
    Small ship, grid of grinders/welders, if playing in 1x or 40kL per grinder not enough build desired amount of lined medium cargos behind, link with conveyor system (most annoying part) and end with one connector. More reactors on grinding ship for manuevrability, less in welder ship for precision is my way. Put thrusters on an 'antennae' to avoid collateral damage.
    I can't imagine life without my medium 'milipede' (25 welders plane) ship for building large stuff (bigger one wasn't that handy).
     
  3. rjustice2006 Trainee Engineer

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    20
    I have been using a 10 x 10 grinder array, with a custom large ship that was specifically built to capture hostile ships and haul them back for salvage.
    The 10 x 10 is big enough to one-pass most ships. The solar arrays can be a hassle and the civilian ships.
    I have considered enlarging the array to handle the mining hauler and maybe even up to a military transport. Need more motivation for that...lol

    Edit: I also have a small ship with dual grinders on one end and dual welders on the other. One cockpit on each end, two large containers between them.
    This setup allows the ship to grind down ships and store its own components for welding. This minimizes the need to transfer materials from my stations storage.
     
  4. entspeak Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,744
    Small ship: Welder/Grinder

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=264431097

    [​IMG]

    Uses a shared storage container for welding and grinding. MkII uses rotors and connector links to swap the tools out - removing the need for two cockpits, but the connector link system is pull only and doesn't quite work with the grinders the way I want, so you have to manually move items from the grinder to the storage. I'm hoping they fix the problem with that.
     
  5. GreenGod Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    16
    Still on my first survival play-through but I'll tell you my strategy so far.

    1) Build a very small ship with merge block which can grab a grinder+connector tool. Minimal grinding efficiency but still better than by hand. For the first 2-3 ships only.

    2) Build larger small ship capable for numerous attachments. Dual grinder arms with 1x6 or 2x6 configuration. I actually prefer 1x6 (pictured below) for the better maneuverability. As you point out, the conveyors on small ships are limited.

    3) Build station mounted disassembly bay for the automated grinding of small-medium ships. We're still working on this one - rotors are harder than these wizards on youtube make them look :). So far we've got a 15x15x25 box that we've had some disastrous 'piston tests' in. I'm also working on a crane. Gravity is fun.

    Our "Scorpion Class" light utility ship grinding:

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Spacedweller Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    45
    My little multitool for realistic survival mode. Cheap and easy to build, small size. You can basicly first build one of the sides, and later add the other side. Ship weight aprox 9,900 kg.

    Layot out from grinder to welders.
    2x Grinders -> 2x Medium Cargo -> 2x Conveyor (connected each other with tube) -> 2x Welders
    And 2 left and right side connector to unload/load.
    2x Cockpits are just for convenience. Under the ship is 4x landing legs to park it.
    And you can utilize carbo space in connects and welders/grinders depending what kind of job needs to be done.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Jurriën van Dongen Trainee Engineer

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    33
    That's a very nice looking ship. It's a bit hard to tell from this angle what's connecting the appendages, is it just the connectors holding everything in place? And does that allow actual control of the grinders?
     
  8. GreenGod Trainee Engineer

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    16
    Thanks Jurriën! There is a merge block below the connector on each side.

    I've got an album here for anybody interested in more screenshots of the Scorpion:

    http://imgur.com/a/apbEQ#0

    Spacedweller : That's a sweet looking rig for under 10K kg! Can you post more/closer screenshots?

    New to these forums, but are there any established weight classes?

    On the subject of two cockpits (a great subject), I've found it nice to have a forward and rear facing one on the Scorpion class ships. Piloting rear-mounted (especially large) equipment or docking large cargo is made much easier facing backwards.
     
  9. Communist Penguin Apprentice Engineer

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    148
    On me and my friends survival world we build a 7x7 grinder wall on our station for churning up stuff on a large scale. Probably not the most efficient method but dam with some good player co-ordination you can shred a whole ship in well under 5 minutes.
     
  10. dzikakulka Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    60
    Yeah, I figure a large grinder wall on station would be nice but never had time to make a bulldozer for it to push stuff inside :D
     
  11. Spacedweller Trainee Engineer

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    45
  12. GreenGod Trainee Engineer

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    16
    Thanks Spacedweller! That's a sweet little machine you've got there.
     
  13. Geneticus Senior Engineer

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    1,618
    I haven't tested this but the area of effect of welders and grinders might be big enough to allow a config like:

    GWGWG (in the same row)

    or

    GGG
    WWW (2 rows stacked vertically)

    Then just toggle the tools back and forth depending on what you need to do.
     
  14. kristakis Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    607
    Grinders have a sphere of effect around them, I think it's visible in creative when you toggle one of the debug modes. This sphere allows you to place them 1 block apart thusly: G_G_G and still have the full effect. I haven't tried it yet, but I suspect the sphere of effect would cut into the end of the welder in a GWGWG layout - I will try this when I get home tonight.
     
  15. Newton Trainee Engineer

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    79
    AFAIR welders and grinders do not affect the ship they are attached to, so it might be possible to create an universal maintenace array. Great idea!
     
  16. Spacedweller Trainee Engineer

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    45
    I have build following setup on large ship. And it works, grinders dont destroy the welders betwen them.
    Havent tested it out on small ship. On large ships definetly those cargo connectors each side of grinders and welders make to easy to connect this kind of layout. You only need 1 point per row to connect into conveyor system.

    GWGWG
    ---------
    GWGWG
     
  17. Jurriën van Dongen Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    33
    Nice find Spacedweller. Makes for a very versatile all-in-one I imagine. I expect it'd be slower than a dedicated grid though, because I'm pretty sure the overlap normally allows multiple grinders to hit the same block.

    On a related note, I attempted to set up a large grinder grid that would connect to a small ship using merge blocks...guess what, large and small merge blocks...don't merge. They're not the same size.

    So I guess it's gonna be connectors and some landing gear for stabilization, not giving up yet!

    ----------------------------------------

    Edit: preliminary conclusion is that a merge between large and small has the same downsides as going completely small, with the added problems of camera angle (can't swing it so the connected grinder part obscures the cockpit) and having to guide thrust in all 6 directions directly through the center of mass (not an easy feat when all the mass is at the front).

    Next experiment: a gravity powered fixed grinding station :cool:
     
  18. dzikakulka Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    60
    A question regarding mass grinding: has anyone checked if there's a difference between large ship and small ship grinder grinding speed? And if it is better to build small ship grinding grids (more grinders per meter - better speed if difference not big enough) or big ship grinder grids?
     
  19. Jurriën van Dongen Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    33
    From my experiences so far it pretty much evens out. It seems as though performance is pretty comparable between small and large, so that wouldn't be my main criterium when deciding whether to go large or small.

    As a follow-up to what I posted earlier I decided to give it another shot and come up with this monstrosity, the Janus class maker-breaker vessel. I left most of the armor off so the internal guts are nice and visible, and the thrusters are all over the place, but it actually performs just fine.

    http://imgur.com/a/ikYyS
     
  20. maxpower Trainee Engineer

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    2
    My ship grinder is a modular large grinder/med. cargo attachment via merge block. I took apart a commercial freighter, and although it worked well it took way too long. Multiple grinders would help but you still deal with pieces floating away.

    [​IMG]

    I'm going to build a giant grinding box next with a bank of grinders that will take apart large ships in minutes.
     
  21. dzikakulka Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    60
    Just completed my wall of pain, 12x12 small ship grinder grid all linked up with conveyor system:
    http://imgur.com/a/tr1Lz
    And oh dear it eats a military minelayer in like a minute. Also made a bulldozer ship to lock on poor ships and push them into their doom, but ships like mining carriages are capable of pretty easy suicide anyway.
    Worth it.
     
  22. kristakis Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    607
    My first grinder: Baby Grey

    [​IMG]

    Then I created the Sarlaac Pit (videos of it in action here and here)

    [​IMG]

    Now I use Mr. Chomp

    [​IMG]

     
  23. pfeife Trainee Engineer

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    1
    I'm just using a 2x2 grinder for small things.
    For bigger ships as a Mining Hauler, we have a 23x11 grinder. We just need to remove the gattlings an both sides, then we can put the hole ship inside. It takes about 2 min, then it's complettly done.
    I kno its expensive to build a huge grinder like this, but you will have the resources back in notime.
    Btw we can grind a Military Transport as well, nearly 200k metall plates in ~10 min.
     
  24. Geneticus Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,618
    The transports are ideally suited to pipe with conveyors along the top spine to the cargo containers and weapons. you can also fit 2 refineries and 2 assemblers in the rooftop slot. It has a front door that can easily be converted into a swing down loading ramp for a small 15 drill miner ship or 6-9 drill mining truck. Dump the small thrusters for large ones and change the armor from heavy to light except the landing bay. They make a great mobile mining base.
     
  25. Raz0rking Apprentice Engineer

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    118
    [​IMG]

    that is my grinding station. 2500 and something grinders. :woot:
     
  26. Laekoth Trainee Engineer

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    23
    This is the grinder array we use, utilizes a pushplate on top to apply pressure on the ships to push them into the grinders.

    http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/35217691649352086/AA348B653951EC490C1798BA19A0FDDF2BDE0D00/
     
  27. Raz0rking Apprentice Engineer

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    118
    oh..nice implementation of weels.
     
  28. GothicRebel Trainee Engineer

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    88
    To help with the tedium of grinding down large ships I refitted a mining carriage with grinders covering the entirety of the front face (13 in all). It's exceedingly efficient at reducing many ships to nothing but a memory.
     
  29. TwoHedWlf Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    65
    I like that.

    Here's mine: Not quite finished here, I'll take a new screenshot tonight when I get home. You flip the two rotors on and the big panels come down and press the ship into 200 grinders on the bottom. The panels ended up looking like a pair of giant fly swatters.


    [​IMG]
     
  30. GreenGod Trainee Engineer

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    16
    Very nice! Care to discuss the benefits of ship-mounted grinding over pit-mounted ? Do you use gravity or a bulldozer ship to push/pull into the pit grinders?
     
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.