Progressive Enviromental Difficulty

Index:
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1. Background
2. Introduction
3. The Ideas!
4. -The Default
5. -Dust Field
6. -Broken Moon
7. -The Dark Side
8. -Jupiter's Clouds
9. -Cluster
10. -Hotspot
11. -The Comet
12. Closing

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1 - Background:
I had only been playing for a little while now, and I rather enjoy survival mode with my friend. The game is fun, and your creations are only limited by the imagination.

I had saw that there was a forum for this game and decided to check it out to see what everyone (including the devs) were thinking. Two huge dominating topics I came across was the adding of npcs/aliens/enemies to add a real challenge or a reason to build certain designs to fight them with https://forums.keenswh.com/post/do-we-need-horrific-aliens-to-inhabit-derelict-space-stations-and-ships-6591699?trail=15 I kinda agreed with this only because it would add more life and some fun taking on the AI in your expensive warship. Not only that but adding kinda some goals to the game, even if all your new goals are is just blasting away defenseless bots. lol

The second topic was the Celestial bodies thread https://forums.keenswh.com/post/celestial-bodies-discussion-6607834?trail=15 which is a discussion around what new space environment objects to add to the game it seems. The thread was mainly overwhelmed by the community desire to have large planets or moons, and the discussion really is only based on those few concepts. Then it hit me!

Why not have a little of both? Challenges, and new environments. New areas and situations to not only give you a serious challenge to the player, but also to their unique designs while being in a brand new and interesting place for them to explore. Exploring new areas not only adds new experience, but raises the stakes and difficulty.

In my own opinion, I believe the community at large just wants some challenge in the survival mode while exploring the unknown, but at the same time in real danger. Of course people must realize the game is super new and the developers haven't had the time to add too much. So I decided to voice my opinion. If people don't approve or the topic is locked away, I accept that.


2 - Introduction:
Progressive Environmental Difficulty is about adding a new challenge/danger to each new area you explore. The new areas or objects may contain better resources or specific ones you cannot find anywhere else, but getting to these would be more challenging than your standard static asteroid map, and perhaps twice as lethal. It can also add mass amount of diversity and fun ideas for Engineers out there (hiding your base in a dust cloud)!

These scenarios are far easier for developers to implement than a giant diverse planet or a fleet of scary NPC Cube ships! It'll add huge amount of diversity and limitless variations. This is not to say planets and/or NPCs won't be added down the road if they decided so, but these suggestions are possibly more realistic and idealistic to add within the game.

Remember these are just ideas and not all of them are beyond dangerous lol. The pictures are there so you can somewhat imagine what they'd look like from an artists perspective. They may not all be super realistic at all, but it'll get the developers & communities wheels turning. =D

So lets get started shall we with these few?

3 - The Ideas!

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4 - The Default: (Difficulty: Cheating Easy)


(source:https://media.desura.com/cache/images/games/1/27/26095/thumb_940x3000/Space-Engineers-Alpha-2013-11-screen-02.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Other players
• Forgetting to turn inertial dampeners on
• Other players ships
• Meteors (really hate meteors)

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-Everyone loves it, everyone has it, It's the DEFAULT MAP! Are you new to space engineers? Finished at the academy with no where to practice your crazy (and perhaps extremely unsafe) cool spaceship designs? Look no further than here! Build with confidence and safety in this brand new-ish pack of asteroids.

• The asteroids are static so no need to get outa the way!
• They all carry every mineral you would ever need like the local general store!
• No flesh eating monsters!

So come today and Enjoy building whatever unsafe ship or station you like!

5 - Dust Field: (Difficulty: Easy)



(source: https://www.viewfromascope.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/asteroid_field.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Solar Panels aren't efficient
• Limited Visibility

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-Check those windshield wipers, because you're entering a dust field! It's a mix of rocks of all sizes you'd find anywhere else in your universal neighborhood, however the fine dust that fills the space around them make it difficult to steer through and your solar panels won't be producing as much power from such limited sunlight. Bring extra batteries!


6 - Broken Moon: (Difficulty: Easy)


(source: https://media.moddb.com/cache/images/mods/1/12/11217/thumb_620x2000/Editor_2009-04-15_01-54-08-29.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Closely packed large rocks

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-Once a moon, now a failure ... This shattered small rock is rather comfortable living space for any of engineers needs. Lots of building space & resources with the just right amount of sunlight. However be careful piloting your large ships around the large chunks around the area as well as building on the large pieces facing towards the sun, you're open to direct meteor fire!


7 - The Dark Side: (Difficulty: Medium)


(source: https://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/569/cache/best-space-pictures-205-moon-conjunction_56983_600x450.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• No Direct sunlight (bring a flashlight!)
• Limited Visibility

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-It's dark, it's creepy, it's the dark side of a moon around Jupiter (or Saturn, w/e). While Space Engineers will be disappointed to know they are not allowed to land on the said moon, they can however enjoy the pitch black darkness that is behind it! Bring plenty of lights because you don't want to crash into the hidden asteroids in orbit. Keep in mind and I will point out the obvious, solar panels will not work here.


8 - Jupiter's Clouds: (Difficulty: Medium)



(source: https://www.skymarvels.com/infopages/images/Jupiter%20Clouds.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Massive winds (extra or large thrusters needed)
• Huge gravity pulling you inwards (again, extra or large thrusters needed)

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-You ever been in a hurricane? Well ... it's like 10x worse than that! Visit the clouds that is Jupiter! (If ever added) you can collect mass amounts of Hydrogen or Helium for all your engineering needs. Be careful though, the massive winds make steering a challenge as well the huge gravity wanting to pull your ship downwards into its crushing center. Pack extra thrusting power to let your gyroscope keep you stable. Keep in mind though, the extra strain on your engines will use mass amounts of power to keep you stable! (Warning: Ground vehicles not recommended)


9 - Cluster: (Difficulty: Hard)



(source:https://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20070707043639/memoryalpha/en/images/f/f6/Trellium_asteroid_field.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Moving & rotating asteroids
• Clustered Rocks

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-This is one place you don't wanna bring you're giant space yacht. It's dangerous, it's crazy, but you gotta get in there because it contains all those yummy minerals you want & probably need because you spent it all on that yacht! This area is massively dangerous for very large ships, however can be flown through with small ships & drop ships. Flying can be a challenge even for the most experieced pilots as the moving rocks can possibly wreck your whole ship, and lets not forget the pilot!


10 - Hot Spot: (Difficulty: Very Hard)


(source:https://img.wikinut.com/img/31kgh2_piqkg6pkr/jpeg/724x5000/Distant-Sun.jpgeg)

Hazards
===========

• Direct sunlight can start to damage your ships hull after a period of time
• Some systems may not function or work properly
• Suit power burns faster in direct sunlight to compensate for extreme exposure

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-Bring your sunblock kids! Your mining near the sun today. In a time when a space engineer will go to extreme lengths to get what he or she needs, even near the sun! Building on the asteroids orbiting here is a challenge. Your ships hull will start to heat up and take damage while it is in direct sunlight. You will need heat treated metal or concrete blocks (if they add it) for your station on the surface for it to survive in the open. The direct exposure to the sun so close is also highly dangerous for the Space engineer in question. Your suit will burn extra power to keep you alive, so keep an eye on your power meter! As obvious as this seems, solar panels shine here (no pun intended), so power shouldn't be a huge issue.

11 - The Comet: (Difficulty: Extreme)


(source:https://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060929002957/memoryalpha/en/images/a/a0/Archers_Comet.jpg)

Hazards
===========

• Is moving & rotating through space rather quickly (in-game a massive orbit i guess)
• Unstable gas vents from the minerals in the rock
• Huge turbulence when flying around it
• Small rocks falling off behind it (can despawn after awhile to save cpu)

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-It's big, it's bad, its the mighty Comet! Catching this thing is gonna be one huge feat for your Space Engineers, nevermind just landing on it. The Comet is a massive moving projectile hurling through space spewing gas and small rocks behind it. Even after making it through the huge amount of rock flying at you, landing or flying onto its surface or interiors is another challenge in itself as vents are always going off, and small rocks are flying at you. It is very hazardous flying around & within the comet. A land vehicle might fair better with artificial mass holding it down, but even then your not safe. Why you would want to fly into a comet is the real question you should be asking yourself as Space Engineer.

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Closing:
Alright, that's all the idea's I had at the top of my head. I figured I'd voice my opinion that the game could expand more on bigger interesting scenarios than just a simple big planet or a bunch of crazed AI robots trying to kill you. Of course those could be added later (bring it on Crazy AI! >ops, but I figure an extreme environment is just as challenging as anything else and can take you to the limits of your building creativity!

I hope this topic at the very least jolted some ideas in everyone's head, even if you disagree 250% of what i wrote. hehe

OH, and the DEFAULT MAP, was just an inside joke i decided to throw in there

(If I come up with more idea's I'll add more to the original post, and put [Updated] within the topic title. But lets see how much interest in this builds.)

 

Very well presented topic, i'll admit i havent been into the celestial bodies thread, so i'm not all that up to speed on the general opinion on planets and moons, but i'd love to see more diverse scenarios added in farther down the line after the core features are finished being implemented.

 

This is most certainly how one makes a first post!

This biggest problems I see are issues with Jupiter's clouds and Dark Side. While cool in concept, introducing random forces might be quite difficult to begin anything in, furthermore, gravity in this game can lead to some...interesting deaths. The biggest issue I see with Jupiter is that players might be sucked into the ship's hull, killing them almost instantly. Another issue I see with this is the game trying to calculate it all, it would be very demanding on the system, and many stable, non-rotating Large Ships cause a great deal of system performance issues for a lot of people; I feel like because of this, there would have to be a {64-bit only} tag.

As for the Dark Side, that would also cause issues as far as lighting goes, because of the amount of performance issues lights seem to generate en masse are certainly enough to harm even higher-end computers.

This said, I think these are really great ideas.

Here's an idea, (Sparking of course from personal desires), a Plasma storm (extreme). The idea here is that at random intervals, plasma storms occur. Hazards could include less effective power, melting armor, and insta-kill if unprotected by an asteroid or ship. (Also, great excuse to implement colors, I feel the natural game needs them because I am a banana .)

 

My reaction on seeing this:
"Excellent post, well thought out, very organized. 8.5/10. (keep in mind 10 is absolutely perfect)"
My reaction on seeing "Posts: 1":
o_0

__________​

Verdict:
Excellent first post! I like the layout of it, and the various areas are very diverse! However, as Forgemasterhd said, this may cause lag on lower-end systems. I would like to add, however, that even on my 4-core 64-bit rig running Windows 7, normal SE is laggy even on an empty world, so this might kill my game. However, it would be excellent if my computer can handle it!

 

I love the idea of Dust Field and Cluster... and.. and..

Every other idea ( ◉ - ◉ )

*edit*

The Space Engineers forum really needs a reputation system for individuals so we can give people rep when they posts good stuff..or for being helpful.

 

Interesting ideas, I like the Dust Field, Dark Side, Cluster and Hot Spot.

But I still hope for a deserted planetoid/moon scenario with natural gravity :/

 

excellent topic.

maybe another idea would be the rings of Saturn. a horizontal plane with a lot of small asteroids (and maybe a couple of lager moons) and the Kuiper belt where you can find a lot of ice, a few minerals but not so much uranium. on top of that solar panels won't really give you anything so you might have energy problems. (off course until you get the hydrogen fusion reactor they should implement sometimes)

 

Your ideas have a lot of potential, I like it. I would like to see it in the game.

 

how would that help with anything ?

 

yeah, we shouldn't really restrict stuff and normally you should be able to pick out the annoying guys

 

Sounds like cool scenarios to me. I want that :thumb:

 

Fantastic presentation, and great ideas. Would very much recommend.

 

Thanks for the replies. I wanted to make a good impression. Really wanted it to be noticed. I do absolutely love to dress up my posts so they are all pretty and easy to read! Even added some humor in there to keep you all reading. =D

At the games current stage, yes I think the lag would be noticeable. But not all of it was to be taken literally. More like spark other/new areas of interest that simply adds difficult challenges. I notice the issues with the artifical lighting too, but I'm sure they'll be given some attention later down the road as it only takes a few of them to lag a bit. hehe

Not all of them would take such a toll on the hardware (exp. Broken moon), but others like The Comet would definitely (unless the game is much further optimized) take a hit to the computer with so much going on. I knew this when writing about it, but the idea was to spark more light bulbs in others heads. Sure, maybe the devs cant do a Comet, But maybe they can get away with Dust Cloud or Cluster if they do this, this, and this. This is what i was aiming for. ^^

I think they plan on add solar storms at some point, I'm not sure what protection you'd have against them. I like the idea though, might add it above if I have time later and more interest in this builds. ^^ Pretty sure this would be considered a scary hard scenario though.

The easy starts won't be so easy if the pre-built station is in the line of fire and has no counter-measure. lol

aha ... yeah umm I know I'm pretty new here. lol
But I hope that doesn't get in the way of this thread. I did post a background above though to cover for me. ^^

Awe you beat me too it, I had that written down but I didn't add it yet. Was planning on waiting for more interest to build before I posted more. I'll still post it, but at least I'm not the only one coming up with these in the topic. Good stuff people!

(okay, I think I'm done editing. I hope) >.<

 

well don't be afraid even if you're new. a lot of posters are quite new here.

the reason Alex was surprised is because sadly enough a lot of new people post useless redundant posts about things that are sort of taboo (shields ftl etc.) without looking around first. this has made some of the more experienced members a bit jaded.

but if you keep posting these detailed and well-made posts you don't have to be afraid

p.s. please don't make such complete, detailed and useful posts. I can't find anything else to comment.

 

Cool ideas. I'm not sure I have anything else to add to this topic.

 

Impressive!

Though question in regards to Hot Spot. From your explanation seems that the location is very close to the sun so things tend to be hot, very understandable.

Okay, now I am confused. Light/heavy armor take damage from the sun due to proximity but the solar panel don't? Considering that solar panels are mostly of same material of armor block and thinner than armor blocks.

Perhaps change the danger not from heat but rather from dangerous radiation? The challenge and requirements still will be the same. Just not from heat but from radiation.

I think the Shattered Moon is the best idea of all. It gives a good story line. See earth in background, your mission... gather resources, eliminate threat to earth. Giving you the various options of harvesting/destroying many of those large rocks, while AI NPC (if added) do the similar/alternate mission and are from different faction to create certain challenges.

Other than that, great job. Gives good storyline to each as well as specific challenges yet leaving room open for creativity.

 

i like the dust cloud idea best. and if that was mixed with the crashed ship, it would be a case of survive until help arrives. help never arrives. players can then make their own story oh how they may have been smuggling gummy bears...
back on topic, the dust cloud also allows for an unlimited space to work in. this allows an easier time scaling how big the cloud is.

 

maybe solar panels might also break down after long time exposure which means you must find a way to keep them from overheating? also carbon solar panels might be better because they only smelt at eround 4000 degrees.

 

It's nice to see a first time post that's well-formatted, has visual references and isn't just a couple of lines of "laz0rs n' wapp dryvs".
What you've got here is less "progressive" and more "alternate scenario". Unfortunately, quite a few wouldn't work due to engine restrictions, such as Cluster having moving and rotating asteroids. The calculations for all those rocks would be extremely data-intensive, which is why the current asteroids won't ever move. And the Dark Side, Broken Moon and possibly Comet would use objects too large to generate due to the way generation and sectors are handled, unless all of them are handled as say, animated skyboxes, with the focus of each scenario being specific features and hazards related to that "asteroid field", with the scenario target (e.g. Broken Moon) being nothing more than a backdrop.
Examples being extreme visibility darkening in Dark side, requiring mandatory lights to see anything in front of you. Constant randomly-aimed meteor showers from every direction in Cluster. A constant gravity source in Jupiter's clouds. Extreme brightness outside of a ship (Inverse of Dark Side) for Hot Spot, making it near impossible to see without some form of cover (tinted windows) and constant, slow damage for the exposed engineer outside.

 

Really like the Jupiter scenario, something really different and would be a great challenge.

 

This is one of the best posts ive seen in any forum from a user rather than a mod or forum admin. I would love to know what you do for a living mate

As for the suggestion this is a fan-bloody-tastic idea and would love to see something like this put ingame at some point. I see this as being a much further down the line kind of addition to the game. Though i will point out here that a drastic change to the game play scenarios can cause some turbulance for some players that have a feel for the current game play so having a 'classic' mode would also be an idea too.

+1

 

I quite like the different scenario idea! Just think, you could have bragging rights if you survived a particularly hard scenario for an extended period of time!

Plus servers with multiple scenarios would make traveling more exciting. You could be based in a calm zone of space, but you may want to travel to a dangerous zone to mine a higher volume of a certain resource, due to its higher concentration in the dangerous area of space.

 

The solar panels already have heat resistant materials on them, but your right to point that out. If not the default solar panel, then maybe an upgraded version.

I think that would already be nearly the same as the solar storms (unless I'm just totally mistaken!) they plan on adding later on. Same principle I suppose (Take cover!).

I like the whole variation of existing environments. Sure a moon is a moon, but what if it was smashed into by a passing asteroid, shattering its surface making it dangerous even for ships to pass over.

Oh totally, plz add lazers n shieldz, and nerf danger because reasonz. lol

When I say progressive, I mean to say moving from one area to the next. I can see how currently that's not do-able for most of these ideas. But I think it gives a bit of adventure into a game filled with massive amounts of potential.

The map as it is is kinda confined to a small clustered area of rocks, you can go exploring beyond that for km's but there isn't anything there. My little hope is to see some of that huge void filled with something, not a really small area. The difficulty aspect of my topic is that exploring the new area would add a whole new set of challenges, not just the same old big bad rocks. ^^

How they accomplish the new environments/areas is up to the developers. For example the dark side, the moon can just be a detailed skybox, not a literal giant rock you aren't allowed to land on. Only issue with that is the artificial lighting right now lags quite a bit, even in few numbers. But that issue won't exist forever. =D

It got your wheels turning in the head didn't it? Its all I wanted. I have so few needs!

Ha, I hardly doubt I'm that good. No professional is gonna add millions of smileys to their posts! With tons of random colours, and pretty pictures!

I do appreciate the comment though. I would decorate topics if people wanted.

 

giving this thread a swift and colourful kick. to the upper regions of the forums.

 

bumpdiedo

 

I really love your ideas~ And so well presented. As others have already stated, I would really love to see celestial bodies once the game is more stable and more core features implemented. Hope to see you around o/ !

 

could someone please finally add this to the megathread?

 

Wait, it is not yet in the megathread? Senseless...

 

I fear so... a ctrl-f didn't give me anything

 

This one really needs to be in the mega thread....