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SE - Abandoned/Finished

Discussion in 'General' started by Dragonspride, Apr 1, 2018.

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Should Keen Release SE as open source if they abandon it?

  1. I agree

    49 vote(s)
    53.8%
  2. I dissagree

    34 vote(s)
    37.4%
  3. I don't know

    8 vote(s)
    8.8%
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. beelzerob Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    429
    I'd be curious as to what the reasoning is behind why beds and tables make sense in Medieval Engineers, but not SE. Isn't the GENERAL premise of both games the same? I know eating is a thing in that game, but tables are still purely decorative, as are chairs.

    And i said water as a decorative block just to be "cheeky" (as @Xocliw the Hobbit would say)
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2018
  2. Dax23333 Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    657
    I'd love to be able to make space ships out of wood.

    I don't think it'd be a terrible material for spacecraft, a lot lighter than the steel that all the space engineers ships are made from.
     
  3. Burstar Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    460
    *gulp* a wish list for decoration? Well, erm.... here goes:

    Decorative:
    Opaque versions of windows (like aluminum sheets)
    Paintable Wireframe versions of most blocks
    Concrete versions of most blocks
    Wire Cables (ie: to run power from the solar farm to the base)
    2:1 rounded blocks
    Small grid windows and flight seats
    Placable plants/trees


    Functional:
    Furniture [Table, chair(s), sofa, Desk, Bed, Closet/Shelf/Dresser, Consoles/computers (sci-fi looking), ]
    LCDs in the cockpits/seats (or functional instrumentation)
    Ladders (yes I know)
    Conveyor-ed Hinges
    Conveyor Junction with Air Vent
    Upgradable Thruster blocks (I hate thruster pincushions but this feels like as much a balancing argument as decorative)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    536
    Well, here's the whole post:

    ... meaning, if a significant percentage of the current or future player population craves decorations, narrative elements, or enemies... elements beyond the bare-bone building mechanics of the game-- in other words, something to do with our creations-- then there's an opportunity for Keen to profit. Downloadable content. Expansion packs. Missions. Marek hinted at post-release content (in the most oblique and unproductive way possible) in his Q&A with Xocliw and Xocliw's mutant cat at the launch of 186.0.

    It's not about pleasing people who have already paid for the game. It's about giving us incentives to give you (Keen) more money.

    I'd be curious to know just how big Keen thinks future sales of this game will be once it's completed-- especially since they don't appreciate why half of us engage with the game the way we do.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,218
    I agree with this list. Get a team working on it.

    Actually, you and I seem to agree that if a block comes from Keen it should be for more than just looks. It should do something. Here's a screenshot showing probably one of the most popular mods ever
    [​IMG]
    Kolt's Command Consoles look good on just about anyone's ship or station, and they're not just for looks.

    But Keen already has a console, so I really wouldn't expect them to make a bunch of different ones. What Keen doesn't have is something like this:
    [​IMG]
    Now @Petr Beranek say "why" you don't need this to play the game. Then I would say, "Why does the game need a cryopod? If you are using it you are literally not playing the game. Yet Keen put it in. There must be some other reason." The cryopod exists so that players can store their stuff before they log off, and it's a spawn point. Also, it looks cool. So what would be so out of line to have a bed similar to this that let's you store your stuff before you log off (this mod has storage space) and is also a spawn point? If players could choose between starting their sesseio from one of these as opposed to a cryopod or medbay, they might like this.

    By the way, those beds are too good for my crew. They get to sleep in one of these
    [​IMG]
    When I let 'em get some sleep, that is ;)

    Point is, a bed you can spawn in that looks like it belongs in a Space Engineers ship would be welcome.

    Some sort of table sturdy enough to take the weight of a few hand drills would be nice. Right now if you have something in your inventory and you want to give it to someone else you literally toss it on the floor and make them pick it up. Doing that on a table or shelf would be more... civil.

    I think that anything else that I might suggest would start a fight over whether or not it was "needed". I've seen other people list them, though, so I might be supporting some other folks just to save time :D
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    Wow, when I saw the bottom one for first time, I thought it was a double coffin with one corpse already in. :D Stuff them in, close the curtains and shoot them into space so they can travel eternally (or if at least one of them used to have bad luck, then until they hit something) among the stars .
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  7. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,849
    Vanity blocks. Does the game need them to work? No. But aesthetics are important. I think we're on our third or fourth coat of paint... aka graphic set-ups. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the graphics prior. I didn't find anything unplayable with the graphics in 2014. But somehow the look of the game is important. I'm a vanilla guy. If it doesn't come in the tin, then there better be a good reason for having it. But as far as blocks go... I'm in the tin and what I've got is... okay. But AS a sandbox game, there needs to be more vanilla blocks. These are the basic blocks that will work across all games unless they are purposely modded out of existence. Immersion is an important part of the game. Building a spaceship that functions like a spaceship in a sci-fi universe is core to the enjoyment of the game for a good deal of people. People ENGINEER their ships. We design them for people to use via an avatar that represents... us the player in a virtualized world. So a bed, a shower, and a shitter... might be a vanity. But we're also building bridges, hangars, mess halls, briefing rooms, and things on that scale. As I said, I'm on the sidelines on this one, but I can see the point of those who want them.

    I myself, would want to see more angled armor blocks with more angled combinations. Shaping and contouring are important. In the upcoming Dual Universe, a feature they have is being able to add voxels in any shapes they see fit it seems. So visually, every ship or base can have some very distinctive curves and design. The more general shapes available, the more detailed (and better looking) the PRODUCT becomes. If people are building better looking stuff, the more copies of the game that sells. "I want to build something that good too."
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    I was completely happy with those models from beginning. Even though most had no texture and they weren't much realistic. I liked the simple models with minimum of details.
    It was style much closer to those I prefer (usually highly stylized cartoon graphics that is either textureless, just materials with one basic color, simple models with minimal details)

    This is my favourite style, so you can understand why I was not that happy with more realistic graphics :D
    Cloud factory

    Giraffcentric solar system
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2018
    • Agree Agree x 2
  9. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    I'm kinda partial to the cel shaded look myself - depending on the game, that is. My own game will be using that. Not just because I think it looks good, but also because I don't have an artist and have to do everything myself, and using cel shading allows me to simplify and stylize things - as I'm not a good artist.
     
  10. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    I am not good at creation of textures and I really hate doing that. :D And textures are not that important in non-realistic graphics
    --- Automerge ---
    Working on something? Or it is plan for future?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    Yes. And that's about all I'm prepared to say about it :p
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  12. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    Afraid someone would steal your idea? :p :D
     
  13. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    @Petr Beranek Yes and no, that has happened before albeit not really stealing... SE being one yet one can't really say more than one person getting the same idea is stealing :p... but mostly it's for the same reason you guys don't really talk about stuff ;)
     
  14. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    Oh, I get it... once you would say/show anything, you would have to deliver it as people would get insane and felt betrayed as you "promised and not-delivered/abandoned" something. I completely understand. :D
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  15. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    Exactly! :p
     
  16. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,849
    It's only a thing if you're charging $25 for people to access the earliest builds. :)
     
  17. zachusaman Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    74
    First of all Petr, thank you for all the responses, it's good to see some communication which is the biggest issue here.

    If you go to http://www.spaceengineersgame.com/news.html the latest news you see is that Ansel contest almost 2 months ago. We don't need flashy videos or long campaigns or anything like that, just a write up every now and then showcasing whats going on and that the team is alive and working, like your posts Petr which are honestly the biggest sign of "we aren't dead/abandoning this project".


    Also this video showcasing the bug fixing process was great and I hope we could see more videos like this, hint hint Petr.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  18. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    <joke>Who says that someone posting here from keen staff means anything about being alive? In the end, when you see a body and there is something moving, it does not immediately mean it is alive. :D (worms/maggots, zombies, etc.)</joke>
     
  19. zachusaman Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    74
    [​IMG]
     
  20. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,849
    Zombie: Keen staffer on a Wednesday night through Friday evening every week circa 2014-2017.
     
  21. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206

    Yeah, that's exactly how I would define a zombie :D
     
  22. Calaban Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    929
    A minimum I could work with:
    Block
    Power
    Gyro
    Thruster
    Seat
    Evil genius design challenges (ie: get to the moon under 3000kg. Fly around the planet nonstop.)
    JiggleGoggle* LCD gif loops to keep me motivated

     
  23. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    That's not my experience ;)
     
  24. Burstar Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    460
    In english, 'insane' does not mean 'angry at another's dishonesty'. I think you meant 'indignant' :D
     
  25. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,609
    You forgot zombies.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  26. Saberwulfy Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    292
    Reaching 4 months, instead a update we are waiting a baby.
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
  27. Petr Beranek Developer Staff

    Messages:
    206
    That's great, then 5 more months won't be a problem :D ;)
    --- Automerge ---
    Nope, I meant insane, like going completely crazy.
     
  28. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    Failing to do something does not necessarily - I would even claim most often does not - involve dishonesty. That attitude right there is why people don't talk about their work... that assumption that there has to be something shady going on. More often than not, there isn't.

    I'm not making the claim that you do this, I'm just saying that people do.
     
  29. Burstar Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    460
    Dishonest - behaving or prone to behave in an untrustworthy or fraudulent way.

    If you say you are going to do something, commit to that statement so much you're willing to charge people for early access, and fail to do it, you are being dishonest by definition whether or not you originally 'intended' that.

    Hiding behind legal ambiguity protects you from suits, but does not change that you failed to keep your word.

    In the real world there are just too many examples of corrupt, dishonest, and outright malicious companies out there to call it 'assuming'. It's now an 'expectation' of dishonesty. Greed IS the engine fuel that Capitalism runs on. Really, the insane thing is asking for Early Access monies in the first place, and even more so, actually investing money on such a project.

    It is possible, nay probable, that EA devs have ambitions greater than their ability and I'm not faulting them for that. I personally won't be investing in any further Early Access projects. The reason I did for SE was because I had a good experience with Frontier Developments my first time on Early Access, and was not aware of Steam's current state. How could you possibly convince me to spend money on YOUR project? Don't answer, that was rhetorical.

    I'm not saying KSH is being dishonest, but @Petr Beranek In my experience, when people start discrediting the accusers it's because they don't have a leg to stand on, and where there's smoke...

    Who gets your vote: The politician that says "I tried to do X, failed, and I'm sorry", or "you're insane for believing I would do X to begin with", or finally "I only said I would do X/2, but I kept my promises"?
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
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  30. Malware Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,664
    @Burstar I'm not an employee of Keen and we were talking about my project, not Keen's. I wouldn't dream of doing anything early access. I hate that system with a vengeance and not because of the companies using it, but because people don't (and reasonably can't) understand software engineering.

    Expectation is even worse than assumption. People are crying foul without foul. Just because they couldn't get a small part of their game that they wanted, because technology didn't cooperate.

    I interpret that that you're saying people are being dishonest by failing. The definition of failing involves something outside of one's control. That's so out there I can't even begin to argue - nor would I want to because it's pointless. I think you and I are fundamentally incompatible in our world-view. Having to expect foul play is in my view a horrible way to have to live. Thankfully I'm not quite that broken yet.
     
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Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.