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Ships still shaking violently when docked.

Discussion in 'Bug Reports' started by list249, Oct 11, 2016.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. list249 Trainee Engineer

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    3
    This seems to have been a problem for a long time. Without pistons, landing gear, rotors and docking ports, how can we even play the game. My issue is on a multiplay rented server, and it happens with all ships, but many are having this problem. Is there some kind of fix I cant find in the forums? Is the game just broken?
     
  2. Lord Grey Apprentice Engineer

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    378
    Have this problem too on a DS survival game. Definitely a killer. As Admin I can just recreate my ships from blueprints I take before I connect them, but sometimes I forget it and then it's such a let down if hours of game time just dissolves itself into scrap. Not to mention that no one wants to play for longer on the server...
     
  3. Hailedbean Trainee Engineer

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    97
    For the time being using merge blocks. Landing gears work but seem to throw off the gyroscopics of the ship. if youre using a small ship attatched to a large ship the gears should work fine. They do for me on 149005 as long as the small ship I'm attaching is significantly smaller than the mothership.
     
  4. Lord Grey Apprentice Engineer

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    378
    This happen also with the connectors, and they are essential when you play on 1-1-1
     
  5. I23I7 ME Tester

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    3,827
    Hello

    Would you be able to describe the issue a bit more. I know connectors on DS completely disable gyroscopes, but i have not been able to reproduce jerky involuntary movement on the ships i used. I used a connector and landing gear and both of the worked okayish. The movement was def. harder but no involuntary movement. I do believe the issue is happening but i have had no luck reproducing it. Perhaps you have a quick blueprint for two ships that are doing this. I do remember we also reported a issue where a connector was making a ship rotate but that one has not been fixed yet.

    Thanks waiting on your replies guys!
     
  6. NoThanks Apprentice Engineer

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    458
    I have this issue, increasingly in recent weeks. Which seems odd since there haven't been any new patches to STABLE in a while. At any rate, a more descriptive report, I have a paid server DS [STABLE] Vanilla(+darky's shader mod). And connecting any two connectors... especially between Large grid/Large grid and small grid/Large grid (it seems much more muted with small grid/small grid) Basically as soon as you connect, the ships will begin to spin out of control together. In my experience sometimes it has been slow and gradual, where I had enough time to move stuff I needed before things got out of control. A good percentage of the time though it's violent enough to damage anything nearby. It seems to be related to the gyroscope muting issue just the opposite. You still have no control on correcting the spin that I've noticed and when you disconnect one of the ships, usually the one you're not controlling will still be moving as if it was the source of the spin. (The ship I'm in seems to disconnect in a steady state as if it was stationary). It is fairly game breaking and as I stated before... I have been having this problem more and more, which leads me to suspect it's something about the servers themselves. I think a restart may provide a temporary fix but that's a troublesome fix on a populated server.

    It is fairly game breaking. I'm getting into some large builds that require mass resources. Moving them by hand isn't feasible, and you can't connect anything that isn't static to anything else. Oh yeah, right... I almost forgot, for me it doesn't seem to happen on anything that's mounted to terrain. I haven't tried it on anything that's just "convert to station"'d. I have no problems connecting and disconnecting on my Terran base.

    UPDATE - I was having the issue, and no one was on my server so I was able to restart the server, and I can confirm it didn't help. I can also now report that it's in part responding to input from the controller (mouse). When I was moving the mouse/keys, trying to correct the spin it became even more violent. So I let off and let it rest without touching anything and it all calmed down a bit. And again when I disconnected, my ship was relatively motionless, and the ship I was connected to continued to spin for a moment before inertial dampeners corrected it.

    There's some more details. I hope it helps.

    OFF TOPIC ADDENDUM:
    This doesn't belong here, but I'm too lazy to put it where it belongs right now: The gyroscope issue, when two connected ships are unable to move, has anyone else noted that they do move just fine if you use remote and set autopilot on? Well I mean... as well as autopilot works in the first place.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2016
  7. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    Hey

    the gyroscope issue has not responding correctly when two ship are connected via connector has been reported. The issue where you have involuntary movement i would like to ask if you can check how far away you are from coordinates 0,0,0? There is a issue that was reported that there is jerky movement with ships and the astronaut the further you are away from those coordinates.

    As for the ship spinning when using connectors and spinning i have reported that and there will be fix for it. From your description i can deduce that the spin on the ship that is connecting is transfered to the other ship. In that case that issue was reported if the issue is different please correct me.

    Thanks!
     
  8. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

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    82
    I've been seeing sporadic (and sometimes violent) jerky movement when using merge blocks and landing gear on a small ship build in a SP (offline) world. There are a few mods involved (pretty sure they're not the cause, as the jerkiness occurred before they were included) but I can send you all the files if it will help track down the problem.

    What I have is a cargo pod connected to a carrier ship with merge blocks; both the ship and the cargo pod have their own landing gear. The intent is to land the carrier with the cargo pod, lock cargo pod LG, disconnect merge blocks, and then fly away. Various attempts (in different sequences) of locking gear and releasing the merge blocks cause the cargo pod and/or the carrier ship to jerk violently and damage one or both.

    Happens on-planet and station with artificial gravity (I haven't tested in 0G). There are connectors on the carrier ship, but none on the cargo pod, and I haven't tried to use them yet (so I don't think they're related to the jerkiness I'm seeing).

    Sometimes it works fine, sometimes it tears the ship apart, sometimes is beats the cargo pod all to hell.

    Pasting the cargo pod into the world and connecting to it with the carrier ship works fine (cargo pod LG auto-locks); the problem manifests itself when I try to drop off the cargo pod (land, lock LG, and disconnect). Maneuvering the ship with cargo pod connected works fine; magnitude of maneuver doesn't seem to have any direct correlation (I've thrown the ship all over the sky and not had problems detaching, but I've also just taken off, hovered, and landed, and had the ship torn apart).

    I have suspicions, but I haven't looked at the code, so I won't speculate.

    If mods are a problem or suspect, I can try creating a new world that is completely vanilla that demonstrates the problem.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Symptomy1 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    18
    I've had this issue for a bit on a hosted DS. I have been able to do somewhat of a workaround if I shut off my thrusters and gyros before I lock the connector. When I jumped though, I found myself in an involuntary spin until I left the cockpit. I haven't been able to recreate this as of yet due to time constraints.
     
  10. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    82
    Based on Symptomy1's comment, I tried turning off dampeners and gyros before releasing landing gear... ship still jerks up and out, damaging ship and cargo pod.

    I've created a vanilla ship and cargo pod that reliably demonstrate the problem I'm seeing... created blueprints... but when I try to export, SE crashes.

    :-|

    What now?

    Edit: Tried turning off thrusters as well, same problem (got thrown out into space). Tried shutting down completely, still get thrown.

    It appears that the action of disengaging the merge blocks preloads some torque/inertia into the newly separated grids, which is then applied when the landing gear is released. Preload seems to occur to both ship (which has cockpit, thrusters, gyros, merge block) and cargo pod (just a merge block and landing gear). If ship and/or cargo pod are stable (absent use of the merge block) and landing gear is locked/unlocked, no jerk occurs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2016
  11. Bobernator Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    3
    I turn off the gyros and thrusters when I dock. I create a group called "Dock Safe - <Ship Name>" and toggle the blocks. It works, and I don't have a problem with the shakes anymore.
     
  12. NoThanks Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    458
    I have tried turning off gyros, dampeners, and thrusters before with varying degrees of success... for a while that was a good workaround for me, but it hasn't been as useful lately. However yesterday I was able to haul a large grid from a build point to atmo without issues.. (Aside from not being able to turn.. if we consider that an issue). Also I was able to dock with another player for the first time on DS, and I know what you're thinking, and yes it was hot. But the point I'm trying to make here was that there was absolutely no shake between the two grids, and the docking went very smoothly. I suspect that it will have something to do with erroneous values being assigned to an unmanned grid, and that any piloted grid will already be using correct values for movement and the shakes won't happen...

    If anyone is on DS and is have a problem with violent connectors, and they can also dock with other Player Characters on server, please do so and see if it's only a problem with unmanned vehicles.
     
  13. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    Alright if SE crashes on upload you can fidn your local blueprints by typing %appdata% into you explorer and go to space engineer folder there will be a blueprint folder and you can zip the file with your blueprint and send it to me or upload it to drop box for example. To my knowledge you are using merge blocks as connectors which i understand is a workaround for now but hopefully it will fixed with the future updates. AS for your blueprint if you can send it to me without the mods i will be able to report it if i can manage to reproduce the bug.

    Thanks!
     
  14. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    82
    Blueprints for jerky ship+pod zipped and uploaded to DropBox:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/42kc2d6xy7a2wgk/jerky_ship_pod.zip?dl=0

    Yes, this uses a merge block (not a connector). The build that I'm working on uses connectors and a modified merge block, but I suspect that the problem isn't directly related to either.

    To reproduce problem:
    1. paste ship and pod into a space environment with 1G platform (I've been using sole survivor)
    2. activate merge blocks on ship and pod (if they aren't already)
    3. dock ship and pod
    4. disable auto-lock on all landing gear
    5. fly around a bit (pitch+roll+yaw as the mood strikes you)
    6. level out and land on platform (do not lock gear)
    7. thrust down until all 7 landing gear are flat/flush/ready to lock
    8. select both merge blocks and turn off (simultaneously)
    9. NOTE: landing gear will auto-lock anyway (this is a minor bug)
    10. turn off all gyros and thrusters
    11. unlock landing gear ( P )
    12. watch as ship gets flung off into space
     
  15. list249 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    3
    Sorry it took so long to respond guys, ive been working a lot and havent had time to test the issue. All my ships do it, maybe 1 out of every 20 docking attempts is successful. I am also about 800km from 0,0,0. I have managed to find a solution that works, by simply turning one of the ships into a station before docking. The docking ship still shakes but stops as soon as i lock the connectors.
     
  16. Guillaume Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    35
    Every time I use connectors I do the following:

    1. Set one of the ship to station before docking
    2. Make sure the area around the two grids is clear, that way if the ships start spinning around randomly they won't hit anything.

    Losing control after docking seems to happen more often when the ships have poor gyro / thrusters for their weight. My ships with a lot of thrusters can stop moving themselves relatively quickly but keep spinning, which can be fixed by reconnecting to the server. On the other hand heavy mining ships full of ore but with only a few thrusters just keep moving & don't stop after docking.
     
  17. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

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    82
    Still same symptoms in 1.153 stable.

    Also, seems like the thrusters are turning themselves off more often... when the cargo pod is landed and locked in a platform, and I connect ship to it (connect the merge blocks), the thrusters shut off. Have to torque the gyros to get them to re-ignite.
     
  18. Flux Faraday Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    94
    1.157.011 (Vanilla, no mods) I have one of these where the ship is wobbling at load time. There are three large grids, A, B, C. A is connected to B with a connector. A is connected to C with both merge block and connector. There are no small grids. There are no engaged landing gear. It was sailing at 100, then the speed suddenly went to zero and the ship started spinning.

    The ship is traveling the slow way from the blue planet to the red one. We are about 500k away from 0.0.0.
    Can share if you like.

    Edit: Turning off all power does nothing, the ship still spins irregularly even without power. Disconnecting the merge block fixes it instantly. Not the desired solution, of course :)
    Edit2: So, I welded ships A and C together with blocks, then cut the merge block. All was well for about five minutes, then the ship stopped and started spinning again. Now I've cut the connectors and once again seems to have fixed it. Will post here if it starts spinning again.
    Edit3: At this point, I only have a ship A and a ship B, joined with connectors. There are no other connectors, engaged landing gear or merge blocks present. After another 40km or so of flying this new ship went to speed zero and irregular spin. Let me know if you want any of these worlds.

    Note to self original is world (4 spin), edit 2 is (5 spin) it does not reliably spin at load time, edit 3 is (6 spin).
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2016
  19. kittle Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,086
    I run into this sometimes too - but I found a sequence of steps that works 100% (for me).
    1) set ALL CONNECTORS connector strength to 'disabled'
    2) maneuver your ship until connectors light up green
    3) shut off dampers
    4) press P to lock
    Remember to turn dampers back on after unlocking.

    This works for ship to station and ship to ship
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  20. tankmayvin Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,863
    Shaking is definitely an issue in current DEV build if you have a couple of large grids connected together. @kittle 's approach works well - zero strength connectors, dampers off but on the most heavy grid, usually a station.
     
  21. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

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    82
    Hey, I23I7 -- have you been able to reproduce the problem I'm seeing with the information I've provided?
     
  22. Soulthule Apprentice Engineer

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    362
    I know this is an old thread but its current and still happens.. It doesn't matter what branch. I've tried stable, dev, rock, paper, and scissors. They all exhibit the same shaking issues with ships. It gets so bad you cant reach the cockpit or chair.. I would buy the game again just to have this fixed along with the character warping.
     
  23. BitsNoKibbles Trainee Engineer

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    82
    As of 1.168.6, the problem I was seeing with jerkiness and merge blocks appears to be fixed!
     
  24. fizzle423 Trainee Engineer

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    3
    As of this weekend the problem still exists for me, between large/large large/small small/small grids, with connectors or landing gear used for docking, when traveling, the ship will go from full speed to zero instantly and shake violently. when the connectors or landing gear are disconnected, the shaking stops. I also noticed that when using jump drives to travel, after coming out of "hyper space" the same fault presents itself, not everytime but about 25% of jumps yield this result.

    help please!
     
Thread Status:
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