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Update 01.090 - Jump Drive

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by Drui, Jul 9, 2015.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Foxhound71 Apprentice Engineer

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    178
    The only thing I don't like is the jump animation. I would have preferred something like in Battlestar Galactica, especially since there can be a decent delay until the ship reappears.
     
  2. DuskandDey Trainee Engineer

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    Now all we need is an enterprising modder/Keen themselved to make the jump drive produce the Homeworld jump effect (A glowing square moving from front to back over your bounding box, with an occlusion effect hiding the ship as it's passed over. Then undoing the occlusion on the other side as you emerge) and it'll be the best thing EVER! :woot:
     
  3. zDeveloper10 Junior Engineer

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    oh I can think of designs. it's just that the game isn'[t ready for large scale battles like that just yet,but maybe some day we'll have the joy of massive ships duking it out with their fleets.
     
  4. Ghostickles Senior Engineer

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    Well, didn't see this coming. LOL! awesome!
     
  5. Echillion Senior Engineer

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    This is gonna make co-ordinated group jumps for factions Hilarious especially if one or more of the group put the wrong jump co-ords in and half the fleet jumps into the middle of nowhere? or they put it in wrong and it doesn't allow them to jump at all? eg SW:The Lost fleet?
     
  6. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    4,977
    You know what. I've just deleted a very, VERY long post about how ST's shields work because halfway through i realized that half of this will mean nothing to anyone who hasn't read the technical manual (and this is not the thread for it anyway). So here's the cliffnotes version.
    1.) Shields deflect energy but shockwaves from the kinnetic energy of the impact still make it to the ship through the shield's connection to the Deflector Shield Emitters (the black lines you see on Starfleet ship hulls, the ones that often look like a primitive spider net on the saucer sections). Leading to this:
    [​IMG]
    and this
    [​IMG]
    and on occasion even this.
    [​IMG]
    2.) The Deflector Shield Emitters are powered by their own dedicated batteries (most of the time the percentages thrown around during battles refer to those).
    2a.) The ominous Auxilliary Power that is often rerouted is basically just emergency batteries.
    3.) Damage can at will occur even with fully active shields due to the aforementioned shockwaves. However, unless you're manhandled by something like the Borg, your Shields will usually fail because you've ran out of battery long before they fail because they break (because if your enemy is that powerfull your Shields are going to be gone within a few shots anyway).
    4.) You could compare shields being hit with being slapped.

    5.) Hull Polarization channels electrizity through the hull and, basically, hardens it by "stunning" the molecules. While this has a positive effect on the defensive capabilities of the armor plate that's being hit it also means that, because the molecules can't swing around freely, there isn't much spreading-out of the kinnetic energy going on. So while the polarized hull is going to take much more damage than if it was not polarized* the system is still leaps and bounds less usefull as a Deflector Shield - which makes sense considering the time frame; the ship is not SUPPOSED to be more or as advanced as later incarnations.
    6.) This has, however, also the effect of damaging the hull faster (as the enemy is literally shooting your skin instead of hitting your, well, shield). No matter how hard you are, you're going to break. And the armor plating is going to break much earlier than anything vital inside the ship. Leading to:
    7.) You could compare polarized armor with being hit with getting hit by a mace. In the knee.

    Polarized Armor and Deflector Shields are two very, VERY different beasts, and the show should have reflected that. Instead Enterprise was all "Armor plating down to 65 percent" here and "T'Pol has Pon Far!" there.


    From the point of view of the Star Trek universe (which was in the late 2300s when we last saw it) it IS antiquated, and compared to other vessels it IS small (only the Saucer is routinely inhabitable, the connection bumps, the pylons and the nacelles need to be prepared for short visits; particularly the nacelles literally can't do any of their regular functions as long as squishy humans are present). As far as Federation vessels are concerned Star Trek is already seriously lowballing it with ship sizes (compare even the comparatively huge Galaxy Class to a regular Imperial Star Destroyer, and even those are on the low end of the Sci Fi scale) and the NX-Class is not just twohundred years out of date by the time of Nemesis, it's also rather tiny. Just compare the NX-01 (lower left corner) to the other ships of that picture. Or make it fun and just compare her to their warp nacelles.

    [​IMG]

    *I have a suspition that, in-universe, the polarization was at some point integrated into the Structural Integrity Field. Would make sense.
     
  7. Gwindalmir Senior Engineer

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    1,004
    I'm having the same problem.

    I've been working with Keen on this, but they can't reproduce the problem, from what I'm told.
    It's possible it's been fixed. I'll be testing it as soon as I can.

    They also have inertial dampers, yet those also don't seem to work when hit. Only when they use engines. Technically acceleration is acceleration, whether that's from engines or weapon fire, doesn't make a difference.
     
  8. AdventuringRobot Trainee Engineer

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    27
    :O Well done Keen! Now us smuggl- Ahem...PERFECTLY LEGAL MERCHANTS can avoid the authorities & bandits with style!
    Seriously though, awesome update Devs!
     
  9. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    They do work, they just have a response delay can't compensate for sudden shaking. Not even a joke.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Laguz Apprentice Engineer

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    390
    Did the physics inquisition just got jumped by something that - truly - nobody expected?

    [​IMG]
    RIP​
     
  11. Manticore Apprentice Engineer

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    Hell yeah! :cool:
     
  12. JuStX2 Apprentice Engineer

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    See, I was right, No Planets 1.090, although i can see why they'd want to release this first, most likely this will be a work-around option for the speed limit near planets.
     
  13. chrisb Senior Engineer

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    1,460
    I'm really enjoying jumping around, its a great update. The only thing I'm thinking, will maybe try and that is can you remote through another ship with you...
    Thanks Keen.
     
  14. KissSh0t Master Engineer

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  15. JuStX2 Apprentice Engineer

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    Probably the "Low Oxygen"/"Low Power" warnings; they're the only "Voice-overs" in the game really.
     
  16. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    3,174
    I'm fairly certain that nothing going on (or not going on) with empyrion is affecting any decisions made by Keen.

    And what's with the "no sci-fi"? The entire game is science fiction. Perhaps you mean the "no fantasy" guys?
     
  17. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    3,174
    I agree with this. That's what makes it a blind jump.
     
  18. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    Problem is that there is no such thing as a gravity generator. Gravity is defined as a force but no one on the planet knows what it is or how it works. It's quite a leap from not knowing what the hell it is to making it at will with machines.

    Warp fields, on the other hand, have been created. Weak, unstable, and nanosecond short ones, but apparently it's been done. Artificial gravity? Doesn't seem likely until they figure out that unified theory Eienstien was working on.

    0% legit. They just need it for the game.
     
  19. jvroberts00 Trainee Engineer

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    2
  20. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    3,174
    Yeah see all this time I've been comparing the NX-01 to Space Engineers because they're closer together, time-wise and technology-wise. TNG onwards just got carried away with the technology. Seems like half the stories in THG and Voyager have to do with transporter or holodeck malfunctions. Lack of holodecks alone made me like Enterprise.

    Thing about Space Engineers is that it seemed to be a game where we had to engineer solutions to complex problems regarding living and working in space yourself. People want to skip all that stuff and have Keen just give us what we need, and screw what's reasonably possible in 2077. As with Star Trek, I just hope things don't get out of hand.
     
  21. Esmea Trainee Engineer

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  22. VenomBG Trainee Engineer

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    31
    A jump drive complete with a charging time and the ability to work even without a working reactor, once fully charged? I can see this helping with the immersion of the game so much and it will do for some awesome roleplay once stuff like walkie-talkie chat is added. Great job guys!
     
  23. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    4,977
    @Stardriver907 I have a hard time comparing SE to anything, settingwise, because it has no backstory. The Red Ship and the Blue Ship and The Piece Of Crap are nice and all but they don't even get names. Or classifications. Or a different purpose. When looking at SE in that way i just feel... lost. It's a sandbox, but without boarders to keep the sand in. And, to be blunt, in some areas it's also lacking sand.

    On the topic of SE...
    Look. I get you on what you wanted out of Space Engineers. I often feel the same, just in the other direction.
    To the right is Keen's idea of a reasonably sized space ship. To the left is my rebuttal.

    [​IMG]

    I get your disappointment. I really do. But just like i have to understand that my projects may be a bit... ambitious for the engine you need to come to terms with the fact that the engine... just plain can't handle some of the things we'd need for engineering. I admit, i'd rather have a modular hangar door than building one with rails but had they given us rails i'd cheerfully use that too. Except it would probably end up carving it's way through my bridge because Havoc decided to be Havoc. So instead we got the Airtight Hangar Block. It's not perfect, not big enough, looks like ass and it's not an engineering-solution... but at least the bloody thing works.
    And it's a nice analogy to the way Star Trek's technology evolved. You know they invented the transporter because their shoestring budget didn't allow for frequent shuttle scenes? I guess Space Engineers IS going the same way. Some features just plain have to go the way of least resistance. But at least you will probably be able to shut off a lot of this - i'm fairly surprised the Jump Drive isn't toggleable like Oxygen. I guess.... le sigh.... i guess once the game is out you can go for No Jump Drive Mods. Urgh. I feel dirty just typing it.
     
  24. Esmea Trainee Engineer

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    @RotalHenricsson Space Engineers is set in the MinerWars story-line, where the "Solar Event" temporarily inhibited molecular bonding throughout the system resulting in planets being annihilated and becoming the asteroid-ridden space that we now have. (This is why I object to Planets)
     
  25. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    4,977
    It isn't. This was answered a long, long time ago: Keen doesn't want to restrict player imagination in this regard. Please don't circulate this misinformation.
     
  26. Nova Wolf Apprentice Engineer

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    210
    Not true. They have explicitly stated that is NOT the case.
     
  27. zDeveloper10 Junior Engineer

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    finally had the chance to try it out and wow- it's amazing! it even *looks* like what you would expect something like that to look like,while still fitting in with the other items.
     
  28. mikeloeven Senior Engineer

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    1,162
    I have a few major problems with this unit

    Jump Drive Rules
    - the jump drive is available only for large ships (stop segregation its unethical)

    - the minimum distance for the jump is 5 Km by default (NO NO NO NO NO JUST NO)

    - the final destination of the jump must be empty in a 2 Km diameter. Any object in the area will shorten the jump and the ship will appear 2 km before the object (More like 500 m 2k is stupid and unnesicary_

    Essentially you have copied http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=341822890 and added in a bunch of bullshit restrictions that make no sense
     
  29. Esmea Trainee Engineer

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    My apologies. I clearly had never come across such statement. Perhaps there needs to be a more visible statement that defines this separation. Not everyone has read every forum post.
     
  30. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    Yeah, there should be :/ The problem is that every time a thread about it surfaces people answer the question and the thread goes the way of all answered questions. I should probably bookmark the source.
     
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