Welcome to Keen Software House Forums! Log in or Sign up to interact with the KSH community.
  1. You are currently browsing our forum as a guest. Create your own forum account to access all forum functionality.

Update 01.105 - Hydrogen thrusters, MP improvements, New battery behavior, Slide doors

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by Drui, Oct 22, 2015.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Magnetar Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    5
    Thx, for the new Update KSH. The last one fixed the Asteroids for me (they were all naked without Stone) And now the lights are fixed (not to bright anymore) i like the "new" internal dampeners too. Now, i´m looking forward to the planet release.
     
  2. Ac!D Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    13
    how powerful are the atmospheric thrusters??
     
  3. Sinbad Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,788
    What if they did add planets, and they are just waiting for someone to find one?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Kateye Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    15
    Why don't you go to the bug report forums? I reported the bugs well before you posted. Oh, "Too much work? Darn." Way to be hypocritical.

    Yes, it's unplayable for me. My base is overrun by the asteroid it's built into. I cannot walk around because the geometry is all over the place and looks very, very white. It may work fine for other people because they didn't build into the asteroid or otherwise weren't affected by the bug. But for me, the game is broken.
     
  5. PsychoHUN Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    28
    Nince update, thanks. But a little more bugfix please? I love new features and new content, but the "old" ones sometimes buggy. Like small ship's gyros.
     
  6. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    I have to say that I'm am a bit puzzled by this reaction. The backpacks real astronauts wear do not hold any inventory. These people are not out on a hike. The backpack keeps them alive. OK so by 2077 all that stuff gets miniaturized and now there's room for enough stuff to build a ship? Really? Just how much stuff should an astronaut be able to carry? At what point do they stop carrying stuff on their person and use some sort of separate container? Why do people get livid if they have to make a lot of trips from what they're building to where they get the parts from. Why do people always build stuff as far away from the nearest conveyor port as they can get?

    In my opinion, the amount of stuff you are able to carry is still way to generous. Thank Keen that they allow us to carry as much as they do. Can't carry enough stuff? Engineer a solution. Cmon.
     
  7. Irish286 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    134
    So what were the multiplayer updates? Did they actually improve things or is the game still unplayable after a bit?
     
  8. MaXimo Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    92
    Just to be clear:
    when realistic meets game breaking is not worth to be realistic anymore, a game it's meant to be played and if I have to keep filling my inventory with stuff on countless trips to the nearest conveyor port for as near as it can be it still takes time to find what you need in the GUI and take it... multiply for 100 times and you spend more time filling your inventory than the time building the ship and that is NOT FUN and games should be fun.
    About how much a space astronaut can carry realistically it's a lot... if we had a manipulation tool like in ME you could push around all the small ships and even small sized large ships (like pirate drone sized) so be realistic give me the ability to carry the stuff around at 0G so I can take a full large cargo container with me build a ship then carry both back to my main base bare-handed.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    Um, because I don't have a bug to report? Although if I do, I will. Promise.

    And I had a look at your "bug report". Letting them know you had a problem is not the same as submitting your SpaceEngineers.log file as suggested here. If they don't know what's going on in your machine, they can't fix it.

    And posting that here does what exactly? And where do you get off accusing Keen of making the game unplayable when they clearly did not? It's unplayable for you so there is obviously an issue with your computer. Sure, other people may experience the same thing but accusing Keen of making a special effort to ruin your experience does not help you, Keen, or anyone. Submit a proper bug report.
     
  10. Mad Mephit Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    24
    If you want things to be super realistic, get a simulator. I've not seen Space Engineers claim to be a simulator - it's a game, which inevitably means that there will be points where realism gives way to gameplay.

    The exact balance of inventory is something about which reasonable people can disagree (which would seem to be exactly why it's configurable), but it is still odd that your basic tools and tanks to replenish your gas reserves take up around 3/4 of your stock inventory. Especially if there's not currently a way to replenish hydrogen apart from lugging around a tank. It would be less of a problem if you could refill from bottles at an arbitrary time rather than "when they drop below a preset value" - it would be much more workable to not carry the tanks full time, but instead to just check in at your conveyor system and top off before leaving the grid for whatever extended venture you're departing on. As it is, though, in the very early stages of play (when you might not have a medical station connected to conveyors), oxygen already was a pain to manage. Unless hydrogen is also topped off by medical rooms, that is forcing the player to lug around a burden that is an alarming proportion of their default inventory space.
    In fairness, even if weight is not an issue (and given artificial gravity, that's a questionable assertion already), mass very much is, because inertia is still present and Newton's Second Law holds sway. SE has taken the approach of limiting your inventory by volume and having mass just affect how hard it is to move around (at least in terms of a loaded ship), which is a reasonable approach for a game - but it can't really be claimed to be realistic in that regard (edit for clarity: in that it doesn't impair you nearly as much as it realistically would). That said, I do still think Keen should reexamine the default inventory values in light of both oxygen and hydrogen bottles - because, indeed, running back and forth for parts all the time isn't much fun. It isn't even hard - it's just tedious. There's a difference that is often neglected.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  11. dirtyredz Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    208
    Keen give you ALLOT of options to make the game fun for you, for one turn realistic inventory size OFF and put that shit on x5, Second all the tools are available for you to have small drones following around with nothing on them but cargo, Third this is an engineering game, your SUPPOSED to ENGINEER your way out of situations. NOT QQ to keen to fix shit for YOU!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    There is no standard for "fun". What's not "fun" for you might be adequately "fun" for me, and vice-versa. Keen obviously decided that adding the hydrogen bottle to your required carry items was worth taking away space for other stuff. Nothing is fast in survival mode anyway. Supposedly, that's what makes it "fun".
     
  13. Kateye Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    15
    Then don't accuse *me* of not making a bug report if you haven't checked to see if I have. Don't accuse me of laziness when you yourself are too lazy to check.

    I didn't accuse them of making a special effort to break the game. I just thanked them for boosting my productivity. It was a joke. There was even a smiley face to indicate it as such.
     
  14. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    OK, where did I say I wanted the game to be "super realistic"? Don't bother playing that card. I know it's a game. Point is Keen gave you WAY too much inventory space and when they took a little bit back people cry foul. Seriously, you still have more than what can reasonably be carried by one person, even in space.
     
  15. Mad Mephit Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    24
    It doesn't necessarily follow that they gave it much thought at all; it's entirely possible that the addition of another bulky bottle to the kit without nudging up the standard carry volume even slightly was an oversight. Again, bottles would be much more manageable if they could be tapped at arbitrary times rather than at preset in-suit values.

    And for how much you're admonishing others for imposing their notion of "fun," you're awfully quick to brand the vanilla inventory as "too much" - and you cited RL astronaut gear in doing so. You are, in fact if not in intent, arguing as though the game should be a sim.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  16. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    OK, didn't see the smiley face. You know this forum won't print those?
     
  17. MaXimo Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    92
    I consider myself sort good at physics so, if I recall correctly, at 0g the amount of mass you can carry is virtually infinite as long as the suit thrusters can apply enough momentum to start the motion of the mass then your only problem is: bigger the mass lesser the acceleration but you can carry lot of mass (slowly but surely)
    ok mr. smart guy and these awesome drones that follows you with inventory and tissues came out of what? There's always a first ship you have to build, and usually for starters the first thing you think of is not an automated drone so you'll buid a lot of stuff manually before you get to the follow drone. On a side note if I have the resources to waste in a follow drone with inventory I usually build a weld drone with inventory so I can pilot it from by base with a cold space beer on the side, if you're SUPPOSED to ENGINEER at least do it in a SMART way :p
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    And I did check.
     
  19. Kateye Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    15
    It doesn't? :) :p :) ;) :D
    Sure seem to show up for me. What's wrong with your computer?
     
  20. Tigerstripe Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    479
    200mb of new bugs!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  21. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    See, that's the first mistake right there. If your first ship is a follow drone and you build it two steps away from the assembler things might get simpler.

    Just sayin.
     
  22. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,342
    I don't know. It's not my computer.
     
  23. Thales M. Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,002
    Great features
     
  24. Kateye Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    15
    Please don't take this as offensive or anything, I just want to check. Did you see the line of smilies after "It doesn't?"? It's not just me making smilies, I can see smilies from MaXimo, Sinbad, and Tigerstripe on this page alone, on multiple different computers and devices, and different browsers. You may want to investigate what's wrong with your browser if you can't see them.

    Edit: Also, thank you for pointing out that using "old multiplayer" beta actually does let me play in the old update. I thought it was just for multiplayer netcode, not the actual 104 update. I just tested it and it does actually work in single player also. If I want to play SE, I'll use that for now. I just wish you had done it in a slightly less hostile way.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2015
  25. mazaraz Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    54
    seams to be a repeat of 2 weeks ago, the second they shift off of "bug fixes" they break something else, might spend less time fixing bugs if every update didn't incorporate 10 more. I kinda feel like they have 10 separate computers and they each do some bug fix or new coding and all have their own "version" of the games environmental variables and when they push an update half the stuff that one person fixed get reintroduced.
     
  26. chrisb Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,460
    On paper I'm really liking this update a lot (haven't been in-game yet). I'm looking forward to tomorrow's live stream too. :)

    I'll have to go in-game now and have a look.

    Happy Anniversary Keen. Thanks for a great game (so far).
     
  27. MaXimo Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    92
    I'm all out in this because inventory size is a big flaw of the game imo leaving the thing that a follow drone with just inventory is stupid (follow drones themselves are but that's just my opinion) you all spoke about "you shouldn't be able to build a whole ship with what's inside your inventory" etc. I play with inventory size 10x all the time, not because containers are small but only because of player inventory size is small for this kind of game: do you realize that even with 10x inv. you can't carry all the components to build ONE large ship antenna or large reactor or large thruster? I'm not saying that we should get minecraft-size inventory that can carry a hill worth of material but at least the amount of mass to build the largest block in the game?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  28. Dumbrarere Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    28
    Problem is from what I'm seeing is you're going to run out of H2 and O2 faster than you can get the ores to build the damn things if you're lugging those bottles around. In all honesty, making the jetpacks require fuel is a big mistake at this current time because of how bulky the bottles are. Don't forget that even in higher inventory settings there's still so little that you can carry at any given time, depending on the mass of the object... unless you have a mod that increases your inventory space by lowering the mass of items like I do. As for the battery... biggest way to butcher the game so far. They practically made batteries a waste of resources.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  29. [GEEC] Ecen Cronzeton Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    4
    I like this update! Sure there are not any planets yet so I'm a bit disappointed, but I'm sure they will be here when they are ready. It would not be very fun if they didn't really work anyways.

    I just wonder about the battery deconstruction thing this patch. I understand that there has to be some cost for getting batteries constructed with 30% charge so we can't have free power, but, why do they come charged in the first place? I'd rather have batteries fully deconstruct-able but start from 0% energy.
     
  30. Mad Mephit Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    24
    Volume. ;)

    But all nitpicking aside, that is certainly a useful benchmark to bear in mind. The statement that you can carry around enough parts to put together a functional ship is just flat-out wrong if you're playing with default inventory values. Even with 3x, it's not going to happen.

    That said, I personally think small ships, not large, should be the benchmark point - but even then, when you start building with large steel tubes and the bigger, more specialized components, there are plenty of blocks that you can't build, on a small ship, from even a 3x inventory.

    Which, on the other hand, is why a basic welding ship is a priority when I get into a new world. But I do think you should be able to comfortably carry enough inventory to at least lay out a functional small ship.
    I haven't had a chance to play with batteries yet, but that doesn't seem entirely fair. They're a waste of time to salvage, and they're punishing if you place the cells in before realizing you need to move the dratted thing, but the change to their behavior makes them much more viable in my sight. I add my voice to those hoping Keen makes the "30% power when made but cells turn into scrap when salvaged" a toggleable option, but that has nothing to do with their actual functionality.

    As an alternate option: have them salvage into a different form of "scrap" - "depleted power cells," which can be either disassembled into their component resources (most of those that go into the original), or replenished with a minor cost of additional resources. It may even be that you make the depleted cells, then construct the charged cells FROM them, as the usual build path - if assemblers can intelligently chain production like that which I'm not sure they can. But having them just return a trivial amount of iron is kind of insulting.
     
    • Like Like x 1
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.