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Update 01.123 - Bug fixes and improvements

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by Drui, Feb 25, 2016.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Draygo Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,297
    RE: SESE breaking. If you are using this tool just wait. It will be updated to work with the latest release. There was a major code refactor in this release and we expected sese to break. Give rexxar some time and it will be updated. Same with all the mods that may have stopped working. Give the mod developers time to update their code. Mod developers are NOT paid, and they do NOT work on your schedule. It is also not keen's problem if third party tools break. After a few refactors the modders asked keen to lump the refactoring
    changes in one update. They did so.

    edit: This is directed at the community, not keen
     
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  2. Kokurokoki Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    109
    Shit. Did the in-game scripts take a hit too with the update? Because I built a fighter that relied heavily on scripts to make the AA missiles work. I'm a bit worried now. :(

    EDIT: Glass is still dookie I see.
     
  3. Mobiyus Apprentice Engineer

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    253
    ''- fixed first start of the game is too slow''

    What does that mean? Is it about the loading screen that freezes for a few sec upon loading a world? Or actual gameplay early-game?
     
  4. Frigidman Apprentice Engineer

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    306
    I popped in game real quick to check some of my main programs. Had to do some adjustments for IMyInventory, but other than that, they seemed to work as intended.
     
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  5. TomFoolious Trainee Engineer

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    13
    I am happy this game is being developed. I love this game...but there are things that are happening (drills causing crashes on the server) that are affecting the stability and popularity of our server. I see that you guys have worked on things that slowed down performance and I can see how this can relate to the server crashing, but crashing IMO is far worse than the game slowing down. At least when the game slows down, saving will still occur. When the game crashes, that is up to 10 minutes of progress lost for our players. Many are discouraged from continuing their time on our server, while others have relentless questions about what we as the server group are doing to help keep the game up. When we tell them we can't really do much that doesn't help us, them or Keen. Our server group can't even find a proper guide on saving logs at a crash, so whenever a hard crash occurs, we never know why! When we have a soft crash (No message received from server...) we usually notice that the last thing on the log is GC Memory xxxxxxx....I am still gathering what logs I can to build a case to make a bug report on this, but then again - I'm not even sure the GC (garbage collection, if I'm correct) is even causing the issue.

    I'm going to guess/assume you have certain people with certain specialties assigned to certain parts of the game code, but don't you feel that there are a lot of game breaking issues right now that your current team cannot handle all together? You guys have 2 games being developed right now. I remember your email announcement of Medieval Engineers when you said that you would be able to have (at least) steady progression of both games. I'm sure many of us feel though, that the split of your team to two games has seriously endangered the successful implementation of patches? Speaking of implementation of patches - why Thursdays? From my "backseat developer" attitude right now I feel that putting out changes on Thursdays is irresponsible. You give yourselves one day plus some to work on the bugs you've caused and then we are left suffering over the weekend with what you didn't get to fix in time. The best day for patches IMO would be Tuesday. I feel Tuesday is the best because you would have Monday to finalize all changes made the week prior and after implementation Wednesday to Friday to fix bugs and work on further development. I'd be really interested in hearing the reason for Thursdays as a way to educate myself in game development.

    It's demotivating seeing your IMPORTANT NOTICE up above...It's nice to see changes being made, but it's frustrating to see incomplete changes being made. Then again, this entire game is incomplete and is in an alpha state where we test changes and give you feedback. Having a change like this though stops a lot of us (server renters/owners) from being able to play the game due to us using some mods that are affected. Overtime we'll find more things that are not working correctly that will also hinder our progress in testing the game. Was this change put out initially as a test to see if we like the changes? Then if we do like the changes it will be developed more?

    My last main issue is planets, which as I understand is a new thing to the game. On our server they provide a frustrating, but sometimes funny experience (depending on who gets screwed and how). Mining is tedious as anything else. We don't mind people mining by hand if they're starting out, but we try to encourage them not to because it crashes the server. So the player's next option is to build a mining vehicle, great! Or is it? Mining in vehicles is very tedious and still very dangerous for the server! Vehicles can break and give way for any number of reasons. I've had experiences where I broke a drill and got out of the vehicle only to see it start "float rolling" along the ground away and there was nothing I could do, but destroy it and build it again. This even happened with designs based on thrusters - as soon as a drill broke and I got out the vehicle was screwed. I've noticed the rocks themselves are exactly what the game calls them "Floating Objects" - they start "float rolling" away, but a month ago they rolled along the ground smoothly and correctly. There is also the "waterfall" bug I've noticed - while mining, some rocks glitch into the wall and repeat their decent out of the wall onto the floor. Getting too close to these has sometimes killed my character, but the good thing is that these rocks are collectible and if they aren't I have admin removed them from the gameworld to make sure they don't cause some kind of crash.

    For a game that has been in development for 2 years there seems to be a lot of turbulence happening. By now I would think your team would have their parts of the game code down to an almost exact science, mentioning the fact that you guys are building your own engine for this game. When one part of the team says "Hey I'm going to be making this change/improvement" I would think the other team would be able to say "Well hey, that could potentially break my code, let's review some more before implementing this". My main point in this paragraph is that, after 2 years of developing a game I would think what Geneticus has posted could be avoided. I trust that you guys knew what you were doing when splitting the team to make both Engineer games, but I feel Keen's reputation as a whole would be better if they had been focused on one game. Maybe a budget issue came up with this? Needed more funds incoming to support your team? Branching off to a second game that can be easily implemented off the original game (Space Engineers) can help keep Keen software alive?

    As much as this was a venting post, it is also from me a fact finding mission. Things I can do myself to understand better what you guys are all about is browse the forums more to understand your operation and the things you guys are going through everyday. I have done some searches to find your team size for each game and the company in a whole, but haven't found anything yet. I am really curious how you guys time manage with building an engine and two games from it, especially when it seems like you take one step forward and two steps back. I look forward to a reply and to be called out on the parts where I'm incorrect and/or being unreasonable, but overall educated on what your end goals are for Space Engineers and Keen Software overall.

    Thank you,
    -Tom
     
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  6. Kokurokoki Apprentice Engineer

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    109
    Okay Keen, you need to change the sound of the oxygen generators. They shouldn't be that loud.

    I jumped into one of my games and my ears bled from the noise...

    EDIT: Like... seriously... its this ear-splitting grating noise. Yeah, it might not seem all that bad for like 1 minute or so, but try mining with that shit on 24/7.

    EDIT: Strangely enough vanilla blocks seem unaffected. It's just the modded oxygen blocks.... WTF?
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2016
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. hesxenon Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    1
    Was looking for something like that, which adjustments did you make? I get an error message when compiling the script that tells me IMyInventoryItem could not be found... did they remove Sandbox.ModAPI.Interfaces from the available assemblies?!

    Otherwise: thanks for the update, it's really great to see that at least SOMETHING is happening every week. As for the mods, third party software/plugins and so on... try to be a developer yourself, lets see your support for third party stuff.
     
  8. rexxar Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,532
    Right, I'm well and truly pissed off now.

    Let me make this very, very clear. I don't owe you anything. You are not entitled to SESE or Essentials. I can stop updating SESE any time I want and you'd be up a creek without a paddle. And quite frankly, attitudes like this are what made tyrsis and dodexahedron quit. It makes me want to quit. I continue developing SESE for one reason: people genuinely like and appreciate the work I do. There are hundreds if not thousands of servers running my code, and the knowledge that my work makes their game better is what makes me continue working.

    I have spent countless hours researching, debugging, learning how SE works inside and out. I work incredibly hard to get SESE updated within a few hours of SE's update. For about three weeks, I had a patch within half an hour. I put in a monumental amount of time and effort into SESE so people can have a better multiplayer experience. For the most part, I absolutely love this community, and I very much enjoy being able to contribute. Several features in Essentials are direct requests from the community. Some of them I didn't really find that useful, but I spent the hours implementing them anyway because those people appreciate and are thankful for what I do.

    The tl;dr is that I work on SESE for the people who say "thank you". The people who scream "GIVE ME SESE NAO", I have words for that aren't fit for polite company.

    As to having SESE features in the game; we're talking about it. I'm not sure what I'm allowed to say, so a KSH dev would have to elaborate. Keen aren't stupid, you know. They've been working directly with me and some other devs for several weeks now. They know how important SESE is to this community and they are trying to support it.

    SESE broke today because Keen did some major work deep down in the SE code. What they did should ultimately be a good thing for the game, but the very nature of SESE is that it relies on very specific things being in very specific places. I am not exaggerating when I say that I spent 3-4 hours solid staring at my code trying to fix the problem. I cannot tell you how incredibly frustrating that was, to chase a very small problem in circles for hours on end. But I kept at it and I fixed the problem. Why? Because I knew that the first reply to my update post would be "thank you".
     
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  9. inventor200 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    446
    I don't think that this is what it implies. Private and protected fields should still be the same, based on how they worded the fix.
    However, I haven't actually tested this yet, so don't hold me to it. Somebody asked what public fields are, and so I gave a definition.
     
  10. Vaagventje Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    9
    yep it indeed works, but for some reason they now keep on making noise... did i mist some patch note? or do i have to look in mod updates if somebody was getting a "immersion frantic" again?
     
  11. Krypt Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    584
    I'm checked Air Vent fix. It pretty epic.

    In 1.122 Air Vents was NOT able to get access to inventory.
    In 1.123 Air Vents IS able to this. Literally. You can open vent's controll panel, switch to inventory tap and get or put something into your containers.

    So, they broke Air Vent instead fixing :)
     
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  12. Kokurokoki Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    109
    Okay... I'm kinda fed up with this game...

    First, they gave us shitty windows. Now, every time I fly a ship I have to listen to the "GRRRRRRCHONGACHONGAGRRRRRCHONGACHONGAGRRRRRR" of my fucking oxygen generators having a seizure because someone thought it was "immersive".

    Oxygen generators don't sound like that in 20-fucking-16. They sure as hell aren't going to sound like that in 20-GODDAMN-77.
     
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  13. Vaagventje Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    9
    oke so i see the anoying sounds that are killing my ears arent just me. good to know then i can stop hunting for a mod that might have changed it. also ofc its the developers decision, but does anybody maybe know of a mod already who makes the sounds less ear killing. or maybe a earplugs mod. i dont know:eek:ops: but you know, this is why mods are made. to make unwanted things go away for the people who dont like them.:) iam not complaining, iam just hoping for a easy solution :)

    iam now walking around with my helmet on, so i dont use oxygen in my ship. so my airvents dont go wssssssshhhhh every time i breath 1 lung full of air. i understand that yes, ofc i use air, vent puts air in.. its all very realisitc ofc. but but.... but do i really wanna hear it?:p


    "All these Airvents are 100% Darth Vader approved"
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2016
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  14. DivineWrath Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    531
    I'm going to mention batteries again. I want to be able to recycle battery blocks once more. While the initial charge is nice and all; it misses the most important thing needed by battery blocks... infrastructure. The initial charge is good for 30% of a batteries maximum charge, infrastructure will handle all the remaining power that a battery will need throughout its life time. Battery powered ships need to connect to stations and other ships that have the infrastructure to recharge them. While it is nice that the initial charge allows me to move a ship to a connector so I can start recharging ships to full power, I think that it would be more nice to be able to recycle battery blocks again. The initial charge only helps me once, but the inability to recycle battery blocks can affect my decisions many times in the future. Also initial charge does nothing for ships that run out of battery charge, or are built using a projector (which creates battery blocks with 0 charge). If you really wanted to fix these problems, I would rather have something that involves power cables or battery packs. Ways that make it easier to connect ships and share power, or ways to make power more physically portable.

    Yes, I'm aware that there are mods that make battery blocks fully recycle able. Thanks to those people who mentioned them. But mods are not the solution that I'm looking for, nor are they the only solution at my disposal. I can use space master to enable creative tools, or just plain enter creative mode and do whatever I want. I'm aware that this "balance" was put in to prevent people from repeatedly welding and grinding battery blocks for the initial charge, but keep in mind that every player can cheat by using creative tools. You can use creative tools to paste battery blocks, paste in the materials for battery blocks, paste in a hundred years worth of reactor fuel, or just let batteries recharge in creative mode because batteries magically recharge in creative.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
  15. Burninator Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    3
    I only play SP and solar panels and batteries (unticked mode) haven't worked correctly for months (quite possibly never). It's not some weird situation where it sometimes breaks, it fails 100% of the time.


    From what I've seen if the total power draw requirement is greater than the max solar output, even though ALL the power is being supplied by the batteries, the solar panels will show 0 output. Seems like there is a phantom power load on the grid causing power to be sourced twice. Once your total solar max exceeds the power requirement you will start to see a small output, but you are effectively dealing with double your expected power consumption.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. nukeguard Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    92
    LOL - "may Clang have mercy on your soul"
     
  17. jynx3004 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    16
    Bug fixes regarding speeding up the game and identifying and fixing one by one the things that diminish the experience (multiplayer pvp)?!?! THANK YOU! great announcement and patch! My friends and I thank you!
     
  18. Krypt Junior Engineer

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    584
    It not working since 1.098
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Riph Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    40
    This is your weekly update that solar panels still have lower power priority than batteries and reactors. If any battery or reactor anywhere on the grid is outputting power, the solar panels shut down. This is likely the core of the power problems people have been posting. See pic.
    [​IMG]

    Edit: Help me out community. Is anything unclear about what's happening here? I want to be crystal clear so this can get known, understood, and fixed.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  20. craigp Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    47
    Given that I long ago released a mod to fix it, I can safely say that's 100% right.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  21. Riph Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    40
    You should link that mod, I'd never heard of it.
     
  22. craigp Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    47
    Didn't know that was allowed. It's here: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=570484985

    EDIT: It looks like it stopped working in creative, but it works in survival? Weird :|
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2016
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  23. Riph Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    40
    This looks fantastic
     
  24. DigitalStone Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    270
    I just found out the toolbar is not being saved along with the game anymore. Am i late?
    Darn, i just refilled my toolbar more ordered and logical, i save and quit the game, come back, to find out it's back to the previous setting.
     
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  25. TomFoolious Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    13
    Still getting communication issues between server and client with the inventory.

    I.E. Transferring items between my inventory and another inventory causes items to stop moving and inventories to stop updating. Relogging on to server fixes this and shows the inventories correctly. Also getting a bug where <0.01 of an item (namely Iron Ore for me right NOW) cannot be moved, dropped or added to an existing pile. I now permanently have <0.01 Iron Ore in my player's inventory until I relog, which I just reclogged to get the inventory screens to show correctly.

    Once again, going along with my long elaborate post: How deep of a hole are you guys continuously digging yourselves into? Hopefully you won't be as deep as Ubisoft in time...
     
  26. TomFoolious Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    13
    I'm only getting a non-saving toolbar in MP with vehicles.

    i.e. if I setup a toolbar with a vehicle to turn on/off a drill, switch lock of a landing gear, etc. etc. - none of those are saving in the toolbar and when I relog I have to reset all of those commands EVERY time. I've noticed this with only Remote Controls so far. Haven't made a cockpit to test with yet.
     
  27. Krypt Junior Engineer

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    584
    It is SP?
     
  28. Riph Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    40
    Huge, huge props to Craig P for posting that mod. His description includes which file to modify, which in this case is \SpaceEngineers\Content\Data\ResourceDistributionGroups.sbc

    At the bottom of that file are the priorities for power producers. Reactors are 1, batteries 2, solar panels 3. Obviously this is wrong, because in this scenario your solar panels will never run so long as there are reactors or batteries running (exactly what we've been observing.)

    The fix is to reorder the priorities to Reactors 3, batteries 2, solar panels 1. I've done this locally and my power problems have vanished.
     
    • Informative Informative x 6
    • Agree Agree x 1
  29. DigitalStone Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    270
    Sorry guys, i'm afraid i only mean the build toolbar in creative mode. So not the cockpit toolbar, although i haven't taken a look at that. Single player yes.
     
  30. Ghostickles Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,077
    Awesome about the highlights, doors needed that, keep them bug fixes coming! Thanx Keen. :)

    WHOA, CONVERT TO SHIP IS OWNER ONLY NOW! HELL YES.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2016
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