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Update 01.166 STABLE - Space Engineers Beta

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by Drui, Dec 15, 2016.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. druppi Apprentice Engineer

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    179
    AAWWW

    the Purple Bug has still not been Fixed .. accepted a Hotfix after some hours last week for that :(

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Bad Humour Apprentice Engineer

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    116
    As I thought when they go into beta the development cycle doesn't change, this doesn't bother me as their version of alfa was awfully beta'y so logically their beta will be very alfa'y
    I never thought the terms alfa and beta applied to SE and ME bc their development cycle. Its just going to be done when its done.

    That being said there is massive amount of progress from the games beginning and I enjoyed the ride. As I think a lot of other ppl did. Although some moments were painful *Cough, Cough* Boomdogs, and at moments the game seem to go down the EA toilet. You guys took the plunger and pulled it back up and cleaned all the sh*t. (sry for crappy metaphor :D) and now it seems like the game is getting along at a rate I haven't seen since the beginning which is awesome.
     
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  3. Syncaidius Junior Engineer

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    824
    This update seems more like a rush to get all the features into stable, just in time for the Christmas steam sale, regardless of whether not its actually working properly. Which is fine, but at least fix all of the reported bugs before pushing it to stable....

    I'm sorry Keen, I love your updates and the work you've put into them, but I really don't think the game is ready for beta, nor is it a solid foundation. It's more akin to a foundation of liquid concrete. Anything you put on top just sinks into it, which isn't very stable. The game still performs worse than a dehydrating camel and lacks purpose beyond "build a massive ship and smash it into another". Survival gameplay is extremely lacking in this area. Creative gameplay is fine, but at the end of the day, it's not what is going to keep the game alive, because there are plenty of "creative spaceship" games out there. Moreso in the last year.

    The best two examples right now are Empyrion and Interstellar Rift. Sure, the games don't look as pretty as SE, nor do they have the crazy destruction system that SE has, but they do have a huge amount of survival gameplay. To the point, they've been more fun to play than SE. "But SE was always a creative game!" you say, but almost every other sandbox on steam has a creative mode (including competing games to SE).

    Overall, the clearest sign that no care went into survival whatsoever is the balancing of loot:
    • A single wolf brings on average ~150 plates. One turret and a supply of ammo will let you farm these extremely easily. Turning wolves/spiders off removes one of the few hazards to survive against, so its a double-edged sword here.
    • Most pirate bases on easy start can be disabled with 2 - 4 rockets using the pre-built fighter. The loot inside is in the order of 10k plates, despite the base itself being made up of ~10k - 20k plates worth of heavy and light armor. That's excluding the massively oversized base you start with.
    • The biggest cargo ship in the game (Mining Hauler), can be disabled with few rockets/gatling to its rear, because that extremely valuable, oversized reactor is at the back with minimal armor protecting it.
    • The military transport, although it looks great, really doesn't make sense. Why is there a military-grade transport vessel with no escorts? Was the intention just to hand 100k+ plates worth of heavy armor (excluding the thousands of other components they contain) over to the player with minimal effort? Not exactly what I'd call survival.
    • The ridiculous, oversized creative-built ships that spawn with exploration enabled. The only way to avoid them, is disable them, because they're too big to ignore due to how much they tank the sim-speed. Those honestly seem more like practice targets for creative players, because for survival they're equivilent to a cheat code that gives you every possible resource/component you'll ever need for the next 6 months.
    • Drone carriers - Oversized and easy to capture once you get your strategy down. The latter part being easy because the same ship spawns every single time, with the same "leeroy jenkins" behaviour as the last 10 carriers you captured.

    I honestly do hope Keen give survival more love than they currently do. There will no doubt be people here that will say "if you want survival, play another game" and that's exactly what I do (you should try it sometime), but do remember a lot of people will have bought the game simply due to the way Keen present it on steam in the videos and screenshots. There is no way in hell a new player isn't going to think its survival after watching the trailers. So you can imagine their reaction when they find out survival is actually just creative mode with limited resources. There is literally nothing to survive against except your own suit's resource limitations.

    Despite all I said above, the game definitely has potential on the survival side of things. Playing the campaign almost made me forget I was playing SE and for once, actually felt like I was playing the campaign of a survival game.

    Keep those updates rolling Keen! :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2016
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  4. Gakhon Trainee Engineer

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    87
    I like the updated block icons, I think with a better UI design they could look quite sophisticated. :) The colorless design is not for everyone, but IMO it's a valid artistic approach.

    The updated thruster effect is also much better than the previous, although it's still nothing spectacular.

    But the switch to 'beta' worries me; I really hope you'll continue to push important updates to the multiplayer, especially to dedicated servers. The stability seemed to improve a lot after the hotfixes, but it still doesn't feel nowhere near being a finished and polished multiplayer experience with all sim speed drops and strange desync between server and client. Just make it work; I honestly don't care if you charge for it as an expansion.

    The best thing, in my opinion, would be to see an official server/universe. It wouldn't need to be a technologically advanced MMO experience; you could simply connect multiple maps with jump gates. Just provide persistence. I really applaud people who pay for server renting and make them public, but it still doesn't feel good to put tens of hours of work in a server/map that can just disappear, for all I know. The current multiplayer implementation is only good for more casual games. :(

    Edit: I'm not sure if SE, with (allegedly) fourteen people working on it, qualifies as an Indie game. But maybe someone will enlighten me.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2016
  5. Cetric Junior Engineer

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    814
    Pessimistic griefer alert. ;)
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  6. Echillion Senior Engineer

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    1,334
    KEEN! WTAF Have You Done? Why has the Asteroids map with the spawnship start been removed from the custom game menu? I am VERY NOT HAPPY BUNNY right now! :mad:

    @Drui @RayvenQ @Xocliw
     
  7. Malware Master Engineer

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    9,861
    The number of devs are irrelevant. They could be 100 for all that.
    That's really it. They're usually smaller teams, but they don't have to be.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  8. Jananton Trainee Engineer

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    98
    Oh boy, 2.5Gb that's a lot of code and graphic files coming through the pipe. :)
    Can't wait to see on my own box what you've done with the place. ;)

    Greets,

    Jan
     
  9. Gakhon Trainee Engineer

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    87
    That's good enough. I'll cast my vote then. :)
     
  10. Naut Apprentice Engineer

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    113
    Absolutely agree. Started playing the game 2 years ago with a friend, build an awesome base in asteroid. We had this cool feeling of achievement going, until we noticed that we basically finished the game. Since then im waiting for a reason to play the game...
    It really makes me sad that apparently we are some kind of minority in the SE community.
     
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  11. Gakhon Trainee Engineer

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    87
    Interestingly, I didn't like the tutorial campaign that much (at least the part I played so far). I felt a bit annoyed not being able to grind and build things and access vehicles as I'm used to. It would be good to see some campaign-like experience where the challenges are set in a manner that leaves the familiar grind-build-weld elements of the game intact; e.g. defeating enemies or getting somewhere by using your building and resource-management skills. (Apologies if later parts of the campaign are such; I'm planning to finish it during the weekend.)

    BUT I found the ship and station designs extremely impressive, e.g. the drop ship, the moon base and the drones. Lot of care seemed to went into making them aesthetic without being bulky and oversized. Hopefully they'll replace some of the classical spawn ships and pirate ships/bases with these new designs.
     
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  12. polochom Trainee Engineer

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    5
    I personally don't believe its a minority in SE community.
     
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  13. jonnytaco Apprentice Engineer

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    228
    Anyone else have like an 8 fold increase in triangle count on their ships? My frames have taken a massive hit across the board :((
     
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  14. flori1994 Trainee Engineer

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    29
    is the issue with the pink textures in mods solved?
     
  15. odizzido Junior Engineer

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    A lot of good stuff here....Was really hoping the power issue would be fixed before this all went to stable though.
     
  16. uys88 Trainee Engineer

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    wierd latency bug local server shows 130 ping but when on server i get 450 ping?
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  17. OmEgA_StOrM Apprentice Engineer

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    128
    Does Beta mean that they are planning to flesh out all the nice mechanics that they have ?
     
  18. eviltek2099 Apprentice Engineer

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    198
    mergeblocks? I haven't had any issues with those!
     
  19. [DL] A.F.T Trainee Engineer

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    Most old bugs still here ) And why wheels do not change it height? It is like a stone.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. wd56 Apprentice Engineer

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    147
    Tbh, that color scheme totally suits your ship though. Its pretty.
     
  21. Naut Apprentice Engineer

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    113
    Well i would hope so. But I cant find much complaints about it in the forums. And in the threads which I found the consens seems to be that Space Engineers is all about creativity. As mentioned above, people get told to play a different game if they seek a survival game. Or even lack imagination to create their own content in the game...
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  22. Stylou Trainee Engineer

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    5
    and we can't create a new dedicated server, i have : cannot create a new world - premade not found
     
  23. wd56 Apprentice Engineer

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    Yea ignore those people, dont let someone shout down your opinions just because they dont want to hear them. Also, the only opinion that matters is the developers, so if they something along those lines then yea take it seriously. Let the trolls say what they want to say and be upset that you are not praising their holy grail cause you see some cracks in it.
     
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  24. DON78 Trainee Engineer

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    51
    Then try to connect two pistons, or secure a rotored door with it to make it airtight ;)
     
  25. Naut Apprentice Engineer

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    113
    Developers: This is a good point. In todays patch note they (developers) say that the game is now in Beta Stage, because it has a solid foundation. I understand that a stable multiplayer and nice graphics was and is important, but shouldnt the game have content aswell? I mean the game has alot of features, but content? Its a nice looking sandbox, thats it. - When this is a solid foundation for the game, do they even plan a survival update? If they do, shouldnt it be implemented much sooner? And if the community would be so unhappy about survival, would anyone still play it?

    Somehow it doesnt look like it.

    I had a similiar discussion, here in the forums, about 2 years ago. Since then the only things developed towards survival were cyberhounds, spiders, drones and oxygen. Despite oxygen, none of these elements are really interesting or even balanced. They (developers) dont seem to pay much attention to this element at all. Maybe im wrong, maybe they just need to finish the other things first before they can do survival, but i have a feeling its not really on their agenda.
     
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  26. KingdomBragg Junior Engineer

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    544
    If you've not seen it already, add your voice to the poll in this thread by a KSH Tester: "Poll: What issues with Space Engineers frustrate you the most?"
    There are options concerning story, missions, progression and endgame content.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  27. Balmung Senior Engineer

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    1,947
    I don't know, but I can't remember that SE was announced as a survival game. For me SE was from the beginning a creative Sandbox game and second a survival game. And I'm here before SE was released here on Steam as Early Access, bought it on Keens online shop.

    And also players have often a problem to get it was "Sandbox" mean. A real Sandbox give only one thing: sand. What you do with that is your own thing. Many people only see sand an nothing more in it. For a Sandbox game you need creativity, if you don't have one Sandbox is not for you.

    About game balancing: that is a thing for a Beta, not for a Alpha. So balancing comes now and is finished near the end of the Beta before the Release state is reached.
     
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  28. Naut Apprentice Engineer

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    113
    Thank you, i voted.
     
  29. Twitchy.mc Trainee Engineer

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    I will not try to sit here and argue as to what space engineers was originally meant to be as a game, however as business decision adding more survival content will draw on more consumer demographic's and sell more copies of the game.

    I would also like to point out that by adding more survival content will also add to immersion and depth to everyone's gameplay experience. What would also help is the implementation of official servers.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  30. Naut Apprentice Engineer

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    113
    In fact, it was not announced as a survival game. It was just a unique block game in space which followed in the footsteps of minecraft. There was only creative mode back then, but then eventually they added a feature which is now known as survival mode (i think it came with the steam release) A forum mod mentioned that they (developers) soon "regreted" that they called it "survival" because people bought the game only for that in steam (me included).

    As for what a sandbox is:

    I know what a sandbox is. It just comes to happen that the game has a "survival" mode, which in fact it is not. I dont need additional creativity or imagination, i can think of a whole lot of ideas. I just dont have any motivation spending my creativity and imagination in a game which gives you no purpose for those things.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2016
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