Welcome to Keen Software House Forums! Log in or Sign up to interact with the KSH community.
  1. You are currently browsing our forum as a guest. Create your own forum account to access all forum functionality.

Update 1.181.3 Minor - Beta improvements

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by flexx, Jun 22, 2017.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,068
    I'm not positive, but I believe that's why Keen supports mods and gave us the Scenario Editor. Those are the things that give a sandbox game life. If you've seen or played Escape From Mars you've witnessed Keen's storycrafting skill. What you're looking for requires talent Keen has not hired because if they don't have a working game none of that other stuff will help it.

    My experience (up until this moment because I haven't loaded the game yet today) has been that in creative if there is an oxygen generator somewhere in the loop the tanks will deplete but the generators will produce enough to keep the thrusters working, apparently even without a source of ice. Just as your batteries never go dead, oxygen generators will always produce oxygen and hydrogen.

    @Commander Rotal , a lot of bragging in this update. I'm thinking of loading up Chilkoot Trail today. How's the Tapping doing?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  2. Gwindalmir Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,004
    I think he means the .sbm file itself, that is what has to be decompressed when loading a world. This has nothing to do with textures, and everything to do with sbm extraction and sbc loading.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. captainbladej52 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    379
    Can't say I had the jump drive issue but that sounds like a pain in the rear. turrets are my second gripe behind the hydrogen drain. thankfully my fighters don't seem to be effected too much by the hydrogen drain so if I have to defend something I can use a fighter for now if I had to. Also don't mind flying along normally in my ships either if I have to depending on what I'm doing. gives me an excuse to explore a bit.

    ordinarily I've been able to run off a single tank or a single oxygen generator in creative while I'm building but for me the drain has been behaving like it's in survival mode. It's been eating my ice and had managed to crash a dreadnought of mine to the earth. didn't help either that it only had about 1/4 of the fuel systems hooked up since the ship was in the process of a refit. also didn't help either that since the tanks that were hooked up and such were at 50% capacity, in essence reducing my fuel systems to 1/8 their normal capacity. I loaded into my world at the start of the month not expecting the bug to be there. I noticed the ship was moving and raced to the cockpit. had about 10 seconds of fuel left which wasn't enough time to even get some forward motion to the ship so I could belly land the thing if I had to. I figure rebuilding the landing gears and the pads I had them connected to is better than most of the ship. Sadly the drain had other plans. Straight down in a 22m kilo dreadnought wasn't fun. If I had full use of my fuel systems I could have at least landed safely but that wasn't the case. Thing was in the process of replacing its fuel systems to be more efficient and basically I got caught with my pants down as the saying goes. Since all I have is a backup copy of my save and no blueprint I'm pretty much dead in the water far as that stuff goes.

    I can play around the turrets thing like i was telling Thrak, but that hydrogen drain has pretty much negated anything I could do in game for the time being.
     
  4. JD.Horx Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,032
    I played it. It was good, it was even better than Keens own campaign, because EFM required your creativity to solve problems on your own. And that is exactly the content I wanted, the interactive scrap yard, the convoys, the exploration of the unknown, the drone defense, the interactive stations, the flavor text, all those things are perfect. But this mod has more game in it than the rest of the game. And that's just... sad. So much potential...

    I want more!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    535
    I think we'll get a little more, eventually. I've gone back and forth on whether the devs should emphasize bug fixes or new content at this point in the game... but they are in bug fix/optimization mode right now, and I am impressed (and thankful, even) for the improvements seen in the last month or so, despite new errors that have popped up. Once this round is complete, I think they'll make good on some of those new features they teased, like new power sources, parachutes (not a big thing for me, but cool) and that mini "basic assembler" (which I really like). Hopefully they'll add more elements to survival mode, including the ability to add more challenging adversaries.

    I am also okay with the fact that that there is no definative road map shared with users. I can see why they'd be reluctant to go that far in terms of making promises.

    In my magic pony land dream world, they would take the rest of 2017 and early 2018 to finish major optimization, add needed foundational features, and then turn their attention to more narrative-driven content. I'd even support the latter if it was modestly priced DLC-- Adventure Pack type chapters, etc. Something moderately priced for existing users and bundled with a completed, basic game for new users, as a way of enticing the next cohort of Engineers, those who didn't brave "early access," to buy into the game.

    As pointed out, Adventure Packs would face stiff competion from some of the excellent mod scenarios already available. I think a true shift in development, from optimization to narrative content, is needed for Keen to bring its "A" game.

    So, I abosultely agree that there is so much potential. This game is unlike anything I've experienced, although admittedly, I am new to the sandbox. Flaws and all, I've fallen in love with Space Engineers. My optimistic hope is that Keen will ensure that love does not go unrequited.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. captainbladej52 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    379
    Aside from bugs and some minor stuff like cosmetics and see through blocks similar to deconstructed blocks, that's been my main gripe is how empty the world gets and feels after you nuke the pre-placed pirate structures. I would love to see randomly generated pirate structures on the planets as well. In my hypothetical scenario I could be flying along scouting for ice and resources in my fighter, and next thing I know after flying over a hill I'm having to dodge incoming fire because I'm in the middle of a large pirate city. In space I could be doing normal things such as doing some stuff around a space installation and next thing I know several pirate ships drop out of warp and try to attack. Or perhaps I can see them coming in the distance and plan accordingly. Ideally the amount of random spawns could be turned up or down depending on liking. In other words some kind of something so that the world seems a little more lively.

    Far as other minor stuff I wouldn't mind having shields though I'm sure that won't happen. I do enjoy the thought though of being able to produce a pseudo x-wing. Wouldn't mind seeing a small jump drive either. Personally I like the thought of being able to put around the system in a star wars inspired fighter. Sensors to me I would love to see a scaled up version that lets you have a range that's more than 50 meters. Personally I would love to see a 1km range sensor so I could play them off as actual ship sensors. Plus actual nebulas we could explore. Those are minor things on my list but the empty world is the big thing. I'm sure some folks will disagree with some of those things but just some stuff I personally would love to see.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  7. SnottyCat Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    56
    Agree with you that in SP Survival, there's not much to do after a while. Some of these stuff you mentioned are already available in 3rd party mods (ie:Exploration Enhancement Mod v.2.8), and have already gone thru some testing.... so here's hoping that Keen would make them official.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  8. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

    Messages:
    4,975
    Still waiting on @Xocliw to confirm which one it actually is, and we HAVE to get him to look at Chilkoot Trail at some point.
    Tapping's doing fine btw, i've loaded her up to try to recreate the screenshot to see if it's one of mine. Even spiking the FOV i can't quite get it right; i'm missing the Primary Hull Impulse Engines. Might just be too blurry. Thanks for asking though :D
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  9. Bad Humour Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    116
    Ill chime into some of the discussions here. There is new content coming and what i know from streams and anouncements is that there is some survival content coming in the form of new blocks and some sort of progression system which is a nice start but the game needs more of a challenge or direction in sp. Ive had this discussion before with stardriver during one of the contest streams. He argued that you make your own goals since it is a sandbox which is part of the fun of it. The problem i have is that yes i can make my own goals in survival but there is no other obstacles in your way once you have solid production all you do is mine and fly around. There needs to be more obstacles in survival such as better npc's, weather, air resistance, space weather(objects with certain fx maybe). If the game was fully MP orientated then it would be fine but mp has loads of issues and there are ppl that dont want to play mp even if it was fixed. There doesnt need to be a goal to strive for but there need to be obstacles that forces you ro adapt to the situation to keep the sp surv experience interesting. Till then ill judt build stuff in creative since i dont see a challenge i sp surv and mp is just too unreliable.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  10. shadoskill Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    7
    Another hotfix, another day we still get no change notes...
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • Late Late x 1
  11. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    Read the in game news ;) before commenting
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. Timuroslav Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    173
    I disagree with the mod should be made vanilla actually. As it stands on a minimal mod server the Enhancement Mod v.2.8 actually is pretty dang hard on server performance. I don't actually, know as to why, but a part of the problem is that small grid ships desync at a much higher frequency than on Large grid ships. As some one who is an administrator for some of these low mod servers. 1 million Kg small grid ships are servers' worst nightmare.

    The current game has trouble calculating small grid voxels and hitboxes. This shows up as planetary lag which cause Small Grids to slide through the world and pendullum back and forth creating massive lag.
    This issue just doesn't happen with large grids.

    Also because Space Engineers has been patched so much, that Mod script and coding has a hard time generating specific ships and ship behaviors also generating massive lag. It's cool for end game people, with lots of stuff already, but it isn't worth the Server punishment. It's something restarts can't even fix.

    We actually, had to remove it because it was generating so much server lag that we couldn't fix on our star system map. The map itself wasn't even an infinite world generation map either.
    More isn't better when it comes to servers, lag and desync issues chase players away.

    How did we narrow it down? Our server only has 5 mods.

    As it stand currently, not just a no but a HELL NO on Small Grid Everything.

    It doesn't help as auto trash removal is still unreliable on deformed small grid blocks. I've done a lot of manual deletions as Space Master
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
  13. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    535
    Now, now... to be fair, hotfix notes, on the rare occasion they are released, are usually appended to the original post of threads like these. So I think we can forgive folks who didn't think to look in the in-game messages, where, as far as I know, this information has never been shared.

    That said... in-game a great place to put this info. I hope this will be an ongoing, regular practice. Thanks for listening to our requests for more timely information!
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 4
  14. Zephyris13 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    39
    Not sure if I missed it, cause I stopped playing for quite a few months, but did the antenna distance get fixed in MP on dedicated servers? As in, the bug were if you try to chain an antenna (radio or laser) beyond 50KM, anything past that isn't registered. Even fails to register in script or with mods that increase antenna distance beyond 50KM. Thank you.
     
  15. Seilore Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    46
    In the video he stated that the discord link would be located in the description below, however, there is no discord link in the description. Where may I find this information, please?
     
  16. jemccro Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    99
    https://discordapp.com/invite/0hIE7GirODUqhfIg
     
  17. viper312005 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    90
    So turrets are supposedly fixed...can someone confirm this?
     
  18. Dwarf-Lord Pangolin Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,597
    Small grids one at least are.

    And that is a very good idea, putting patch notes in-game like that. Not everyone who plays the game checks the forums, but everyone who plays the game does ... um ... well, play the game.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. Spets Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,209
    for me only large grid turrets works, but only Owned shoot at pirate faction. The pirate factions is not shooting at me
     
  20. captainbladej52 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    379
    @I23I7 Since folks mentioned the turrets I prepared a follow up video for you guys to my previous video. Good news is that the turrets will actually target grids now after one of the latest fixes. Bad news, about 4 more bugs have cropped up to deal with turrets, and 5th bug dealing with the build system. I demonstrate them in my video for you so you can see them in action but will give a very brief rundown here.

    1: Turrets skip from direction to direction. Basically the turrets seem to "skip" from direction to direction and the fluid rotation animation is no longer present. In one frame the turret could be pointed towards a right facing direction and the next frame it will be pointed to the left. they attempt to rotate as normal but the animation ultimately skips more often than not.
    2: turrets do not play their rotation sound. since they're skipping they also are not playing their rotation sounds. The only time I can get the turrets to rotate normally and play the sound is if I take control of the turret and move it manually through use of a control chair.
    3: turrets are shooting through their grids. I was not able to catch it on tape in time but in some instances I have observed turrets shooting through their attached grids. I have not yet seen missile turrets do this but gatlings have been for me.
    4: turrets also shooting even if they will hit their respective grid. I could swear I read in some patch notes that it was changed so they wouldn't shoot themselves and such. even still the turrets are shooting themselves again and also their grids.
    5: build system is not targeting the correct blocks when I attempt to place a new one. depending on the block i'm attempting to place, it will not target the correct block nor will it display the hologram for block placement. in some instances if I go to a random angle it will sometimes let me place the block, but more often than not it just fails to do so.

    that's the very brief and basic rundown. as last time the video is unlisted and I've included the link below for you guys. tis very much appreciated the work you guys have done to fix the issues.

     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  21. KissSh0t Master Engineer

    Messages:
    3,508
    Landing legs still detach when using jump drive.................... Still waiting for this to be fixed.
     
  22. Thrak Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    535
    I know. I share your pain. But @I23I7 said it was in the proverbial pipeline. In the meantime, I'll be taking the scenic route :p
     
  23. rhinorulz Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    1
    don't know if from this update or previous updates, Gravity gens are currently broke. one can not make a -G area on a planet (even with creative power) [it shows i'm in 1.181.301]
     
    • Late Late x 1
  24. GrindyGears Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,787
    That's by design, gravity generators do not work In natural gravity greater than X value (I remember something with a 5, but I don't remember the unit or decimal place....)
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  25. Kham Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    477
    As Phoenix84 pointed out, I'm not talking about textures. I'm talking about the .sbm files for mods. Using them from compressed format is why running more than a couple of mods (or sometimes even just one large mod) causes load times to become ridiculous. I have a thread linked in my signature where I posted some details a while ago about the difference it made to my world running the mods in extracted format.

    Not sure why my initial post in this thread received two dislikes, guess people enjoy long load times.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  26. Timuroslav Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    173
    It's not a dislike button it's a Disagree button. The other thing is I just don't agree with the mod load times are more important than game optimization. One faulty bug can really ruin a game experience, especially when your jump drive decides to jump your friend 33 Light Seconds away (1 Light second = 299792 km), which happened to me on a server. I don't dislike you I just Disagree with your statement.

    You like mods, I don't care for them because they always break. But Game bugs affect EVERYBODY.

    Also the final thing I find frustrating is that some of these mods actually CREATE BUGS. Running a antenna mod on our server actually Bugged out Laser Antennas where as they were fine before.

    Everyone is modding their servers and complaining that the game is broken so badly, but running a less mod server it runs pretty damn good. Except for the small grid Pendulum_swinging in the planet lag generation, and the Trash removal not working properly for small grids.

    Pretty much, a lot of these bugs are ghost mod bugs, I feel like.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  27. SnottyCat Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    56
    Read my post....I said SP solo gameplay not MP server. There are plenty of issues on MP server play that does not show up in SP. The current release, which was targeted at optimizing MP gameplay, really screwed up SP play so much that I am now forced to run the previous major release. In the pursuit of making a good MP game, SE should not forget about SP gameplay, after all that's what got me into SE.
    Perhaps this is why it should be vanilla, that way devs can fix/optimize it if it's official....maybe let MP servers disable those features that are MP unfriendly.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  28. Kham Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    477
    Yeah I actually meant 'disagree' but I was typing fast and didn't proof read haha.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the game doesn't need some serious optimisations or bug fixes. But as somebody who has used over a hundred mods for well over a year now I don't find mods to be an issue in and of themselves provided you use mods which are maintained to the latest code standards.

    I wasn't saying load times were the only issue I have with the game, but more that in MP specifically the game has a LOT of issues with things like de-sync which can only be fixed by restarting your client or sometimes even the server and these bugs in particular would be easier to handle until they are finally fixed if you didn't have to deal with a five minute load screen. I have over 1500 hours of game time and most of that is clocked in MP games. For a while we actually had a running joke about playing on our server because for every hour we played we usually had two or three re-loads (10-15 minutes) to get around issues such as ships not visible to one player, one person not able to interact with things, newly built LCDs not showing any text, conveyors not working on a ship or station if you've moved out of draw distance and back again etc. It's just one of these things which would be an instant quality of life improvement for the game.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  29. Meteo Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    38
    I do not know where the noses are the arrangements they say, because I've been watching my ships explode for Desynchronization all week. Although today has been the height already, one of my ships parked with the landing gear (on planet with gravity) ... unlock the landing gear and the ship magically goes off and turned around to finish exploding 300 meters But there is. Well, I do not know what they fixed on the landing gear. The synchronization the worst of these four years, only game in dedicated multiplayer and never .... JAMAS had gone so badly the game. What the hell is it for me to have 80 FPS and a Simulation Speed of 1.00 if when you feel like it, which happens every few minutes, it becomes lentisimo, desynchronized and ultimately unplayable.

    I do not know if any members belonging to the development group will come to know these words, but of course, so I hope you will know that GENTLEMEN IS HAVING TIME TO FIX THE THINGS THIS CAN NOT FOLLOW LONGER AND WORSE WITH THE MONTHS /YEARS. As much as you fix or better some things, everything else is broken and every week / month / year less and less gameplay. I had returned from a break of 6 months and JAMAS had gone so badly the game in Dedicated Server. For a whole week I've been watching as my ships explode by desynchronization, by absurd slumps of Simulation Speed, by landing trains that eject the ships ... By engines that supposedly should be able to with the weight of a ship, therefore if those that you have Put it do not lift it put more and should lift it, because with the atmospherics is not so you put more engines and even less. The consumption of hydrogen propellants is absurd for the size of the hydrogene tanks, with the full tank you just have to move on land surface, what the fuck are these thrusters serve and because noses have to be so big tank if it lasts just minutes ? ...

    And I do not follow because if not do not finish, but in general very nice graphics, and many FPS if, but not worth at all-100000 gameplay ... content 0, incentives to play it -100000. And the funniest of all SPACE ENGINEERS ... engineers of what ...? If they do not have anything of engineering this game, and for two pieces that could be minuscule engineering, rotors and pistons, insertable if already the other structures without them suffer the consequences of the current state of the game. They should call it Space Tetris, engineers ....?

    And that in a dedicated server increase the number of players (surpassing the 10 players) and that it still gets worse, worse and worse .... playing.

    I will not say that in a few months I will not play again, because that stage has already passed this is behind and increasingly worse rather than better, it is time for its developers to start fixing things and not to shit yet , Is an endless development ... that if in the meantime selling a copy over here and another over there.

    Sorry for my english, i'm use google translator.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 4
    • Funny Funny x 2
  30. captainbladej52 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    379
    There's a few things in your post that need to be addressed as I believe you have them based on misconceptions. First and foremost desynchronization is largely dependent on the game but also on your rig as well. If you don't have a good enough computer to run the game then you will run into issues. I've seen ships start to float off before when turning off a landing gear but never have I seen one just randomly turn on its own and explode. This game is still in the Beta stages of development and isn't even technically released yet. This means that not all features have been implemented and not all optimizations have been made. If you're expecting the game to run like Minecraft or another game that's been out for years you're going to have a very bad time. Games like Minecraft and others have had years to polish their product and it took them years to develop said products before their release. You can't expect this game to be completely optimized yet and you can't expect it to run like a completely developed game because it's not a completely developed game.

    Far as fixing issues goes, dealing with computer code can be a pain in the butt. It takes time to fix issues when dealing with code. One little thing out of place in a computer code can cause the whole thing to not work. There are things we all wish worked better and were fixed, however I would rather them take their time and fix it right than have to put out 30-40 different hotfixes. Far as the ships themselves go there's a few things you're not thinking about when it comes to thrusters and so on. Simply putting thrusters on the ship is not guaranteed to get the ship off the ground. Each type of thruster has their pros and cons.

    Atmospheric: as their name implies they only work in the atmosphere and do nothing at all in space. The higher up you go the less effective they become. I believe they finally give out at about 5-6km, I don't remember the exact number off the top of my head. Atmospheric thrusters also take alot of power in order to run them but are great for anything on a planet.

    Ion: Ion thrusters are another form of thruster that is powered purely be electricity. They can be powered by reactors, solar panels, and/or batteries. Ion thrusters are used primarily for space travel only. They take awhile to get up to speed and take awhile to slow down but they work. Ion thrusters also have a severe penalty for operating in the atmosphere. While on a planet's surface they operate at 30% of their normal capacity. The higher up you go the more effective they become reaching full power in space.

    Hydrogen: these thrusters work great in atmosphere or in space. They provide the most reliable thrust and are consistent in atmosphere or in space. They are also the most powerful thrusters as well. With that said hydrogen thrusters must also be connected to either a hydrogen tank and/or oxygen generators in order to function.

    I personally don't like how easily hydrogen is used up either and believe the tanks should be able to hold alot more than they do now, but it is what it is. How long your hydrogen lasts depends largely on how many thrusters, tanks, and oxygen generators are in use. Let's suppose a hydrogen tank can hold 1000 units of hydrogen. Let's also suppose that you connect a thruster that uses 1 unit of hydrogen in a second. Lets also suppose your ship is able to generate 50 units of hydrogen per second. Let's suppose you add 49 more thrusters. This means that you would be using 50 units per second but also regenerating 50 units per second. Let's suppose you then add 50 additional thrusters. You would then be using 100 units of fuel per second and regenerating only 50. So you are using twice as much fuel at that point as you are regenerating and thus will eventually run out of fuel.

    As for fixing issues, they do indeed fix things. They may not fix issues as fast as we all may like but they do get things done. I wish it was as easy as them flipping a switch but sadly it's not. If you take the time to report issues as myself and others do, then they know what's going on and can formulate a fix. If you never report an issue then odds are they won't know and it can't be fixed as a result.

    As far as content goes, I wish there were more randomly generated pirate structures and such around the world, just that little something extra to keep the worlds from feeling so barren. Now with that said, even without the extra randomly generated structures, there is plenty of stuff to do in game. In part it is what you make of the game with what you have. No one said you have to use a block type simply because it exists. I personally have never used rotors or pistons in any of my builds, not because they're bad blocks, but because I've never needed them. Give it some time dude and eventually some of the issues will get fixed.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.