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Full Mapping Options For Analogue Axis and Controller Buttons

Discussion in 'Suggestions and Feedback' started by mikeloeven, Dec 7, 2015.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. mikeloeven Senior Engineer

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    1,162
    So apparently while SE does support the Xbox Controller and will receive input from a number of game-pads and joysticks there is a fundamental issue with how the game supports this and that is the fact that there are no mapping options and any axis is read as a keystroke instead of an analogue input. when selecting a control to map the game will not register inputs from controller buttons. Additionally this thing about using ""Profiles"" for the xbox controller is stupid since any controller even the xbox can be mapped as a generic game-pad.

    Essentially what is needed is a 4'th column in the control mappings for joystick/gamepad. this 4'th column will accept mappings from any analogue axis or controller button using as generic a system as possible removing the need to individually support controllers



    Generally speaking mouse controls are fine for flying however when you get into rovers and steering using actual wheels there is a need for precision analogue input that goes beyond the mouse and controller and joystick mappings need to be bound to wheels as analogue inputs rather than key-presses mapping axis directly to steering positions within the constraints provided by the suspension
     
    • Agree Agree x 13
  2. eviltek2099 Apprentice Engineer

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    198
    I just got a Ed Tracker and I am VERY disappointed with the current control settings. PLEASE!! Keen put a someone on this and make it so multiple joysticks can be used with configurable button actions and axis assignment. in my case I would like to assign joystick(ED) to "look around axis" only and not ship controls.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2015
  3. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

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    4,845
    I'd like to see direct MIDI support including MIDI mapping. You can do this in a round-about way via usage of MIDI Yolk.

    The advantage of MIDI support is being able to access a wide variety of controllers and control surfaces. For under $100, you can have a grid of 64 buttons to program with. This would be perfect to link directly to the Toolbar.

    The other great thing about the MIDI standard is that it also works with iPads and iPhones. So apps can be build (by software such as Lemur) to add a custom set of virtual controls on the screen of the iPad.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    15
    I support this,

    Fully customizable controller support should be a thing by now.

    Especially with planets and gravity, being able to gently adjust vertical trust should be possible but the current controller config for vertical trust is a BUTTON !

    Being able to reference controller input inside in game script could be nice.

    Support for older controller would be nice too.

    Being able to map an axis to a specific truster would also be very nice.

    With new mods like "Realistic Thrusters" it is even more important to have a more precise control over thursters.

    Also a wiser inertia dampener would be nice. The current one is unable to use different values for each thrusters which would be very usefull with Realistic thruster.

    Anyway

    Full controller support would be a nice start.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
  5. J Kuyper Trainee Engineer

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    43
    I have a 3DConnexion 3D mouse. (http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/spacemouse.html) This device is perfect for controlling ships, rovers, (maybe even engineers). With mapping, I should be able to use my 3D mouse (6 control axis).

    I also have a flight yoke and pedals. It has 5 control axis plus 16 switches. The pedals have three control axis. I would love to map these to functions in space engineers as well.

    I guess the point is that there are a lot of different controllers out there to be considered. Mapping controller axis to functions is a great first step.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. Grit Breather Junior Engineer

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    874
    Bump for relevance.
    A game with controller support should also support analogue sticks properly. Engineers might be ok with FULL POWER AHEAD but pilots rarely run like that. We are pilots when we're done building!
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  7. J Kuyper Trainee Engineer

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    43
    I agree. In fact, most of history's test pilots were engineers!

    Even the earliest manned spacecraft used two joysticks. I believe the left joystick controls Pitch and Yaw, the right joystick controls slew up/down and left/right. Forward and braking thrusters were controlled with buttons on the joysticks.
    So, to be realistic, we wound need to connect and map two joysticks to our computers!

    Food for thought...
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  8. strangecalibur Trainee Engineer

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    72
    YES! Please, please, please!
     
  9. SixMarbles Trainee Engineer

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    1
    Yes, I cannot agree more. If I were able to bind vertical thrust to an analog axis, I would literally sit at my computer and play this game with HOTAS / Pedals until I starved. This is my most desired feature by far.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  10. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    15
    Bump !

    I would like to have a bit on feedback from the dev team on that suggestion.

    Thanks
     
  11. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    3,192
    Might I point out that when your character sits in a flight seat/cockpit how is it controlling the craft? WITH TWO JOYSTICKS!!! I have yet to see an actual spacecraft controlled with mouse and keyboard. I know you hardcore PC FPS gamers have gotten used to it, but dammit there's some awesome control hardware out there that's just begging to be attached to SE.
    YES. Seriously.
     
  12. Ronin1973 Master Engineer

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    4,845

    A bit of a necro-response... but the entry point for SpaceMice is about $800 to well over $1200. I shudder to think what the enterprise edition costs. They look to be awesome tools, but for gaming... they are a bit out of reach... considering they cost more than the average computer.
     
  13. 666Savior Apprentice Engineer

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    196
    No problem for me, I have the saitek x52. But +1 with this idea. been wanting to be able to use my stuff to fly ships since I got the game
     
  14. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    15
    So the game was "released" 2 and a half years ago, Xbox controller support was added exactly a year ago, VR is being added to a lot of games everywhere. I think that adding this kind of controller support would be a nice step forward to open the door for VR.
    --- Automerge ---
    Also being able to map axis or keys to a part or group of part would be nice. With a mod like Realistic Thrusters : http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=575893643 That would mean being able to maneuver a ship using only thrusters :D
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. AgentMN Trainee Engineer

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    15
    Actually the SpaceNavigator mouse its self is $100 (the one that just looks like a shiny knob with no other controls). Mine just arrived today. With vJoy the forward back left right controls are correct but mouse roll is mapped to pitch, mouse pitch is mapped to yaw, mouse yaw and mouse up/down aren't mapped to anything.
     
  16. eviltek2099 Apprentice Engineer

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    198
    You think after a year of this post being here that we would get some sort of feed back.... I doubt a single KEEN programmer has even seen this! PLEASE make Key and Axes assignment better!!!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. GDeXCrimson Trainee Engineer

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    1
    If you scroll down to the bottom, you can see that they merely haven't started work on joystick functionality yet, but we can infer from this that it should be coming relatively soon. http://www.spaceengineersgame.com/features.html
     
  18. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    15
    Hey what's up !

    I'm still around waiting for this feature to happen :)

    Since it is now in BETA I would have thought that it would be here by now...

    Anyway, I would still love to see this happen.

    Thanks
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Xanthyn Trainee Engineer

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    62
    Sorry to be a necro but yeah, this has been on my mind for a long time - it would be very nice to be able to use devices with knobs, sliders, and joysticks to do things like fine tuned thruster control or directly controlling pistons, rotors, etc.
     
  20. odizzido Junior Engineer

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    672
    While they're at it they could add the rest of the controls to the list of bindable ones.
     
  21. Vrmithrax Senior Engineer

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    1,017
    I've been hoping for something on this as well... Between my basic 3DConnexxion SpaceMouse and my HOTAS flight controller, I'd like to have some actual analog options to map my controls to. Binary thruster controls for every axis makes less and less sense to me.
     
  22. ErrJect Trainee Engineer

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    17
    I agree; I recently dug out and plugged in my old joystick controller, but it defaulted to controlling only thruster movement on the local X/Y plane, with buttons 1 and 2 controlling movement up and down. I'd have rather rebound the stick and buttons to rotation and tool/weapon control respectively.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  23. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    15
    Bump, this is still not implemented.
     
  24. mikeloeven Senior Engineer

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    1,162
    This comes up every now and again and honestly it is getting kinda disgusting that something as basic as support for full mapping of analog inputs is still not implemented. One of the most problematic issues in space engineers is the way thrusters work and based on mass and cargo load you either have over or under powered thrusters there is really no sweet spot. If you could map analogue inputs flying would be much safer as if you have a overpowered ship you wont instantly hit max speed and crash into an asteroid by pressing a keyboard key and launching from planets would be amazing with throttle control. Also if this does eventually get implemented please dont do something stupid like add throttle support for the forward thrusters but ignore other directions as a lot of joysticks have a secondary thumb stick for just this kind of situation. Simulation games have always supported analogue inputs especially for thrust and maneuvering and it really boggles the mind that keen cannot do something this basic despite it being a day one feature request. Not to mention how amazing the game could be if these analogue inputs could be further mapped to rotors pistons and other mechanisms in the game.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  25. odizzido Junior Engineer

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    672
    Yup, still waiting for good control. This is so important I don't understand why it hasn't been done already.
     
  26. Patrix87 Trainee Engineer

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    They are overhauling graphics and physics and everything...

    But allowing proper mapping of controls... nope.

    Apparently it's more important to have a beautiful game than a playable game...

    On another note, I think they should implement a more realistic physics mode.

    Many mods already do it but I think it should be part of the game as a game-mode selection.

    Maybe with that they would understand how important it is to have map-able analog controls.

    Anyway, I'm sadly starting to lose hope on this one.

    I played hundreds of hours and I love the game but I feel like it needs to be pushed to another level in order to bring a new wave of enjoyment.

    Thanks to the Devs for that fabulous game.
     
  27. NoThanks Apprentice Engineer

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    458
    I keep checking in to see how things are progressing, hoping they'll turn the ship around. But the game has been rendered unplayable for me, for quite a few updates now. I signed on with this latest major to see how things had gone... wheels seem to have improved significantly, but I'm still topping out at -8 frames per second, when I used to be able to play in the 20-30 range with dips down into the teens. My personal hardware issues aside, it seems that every step forward with this game is met with a dozen or so steps back. A few quick hotfixes later and we're right back up to one step forward, two steps back. Oh well. I got my money's worth outta the game and appreciate the devs giving me the opportunity. Here's hoping they manage to do something to fix all that troubles this ailing, beaten, but not quite dead horse.

    Also I check on forums for the hilarity that is the sporadic keen response. The original post is just over two years old now... in that time they have still managed to fail to provide controller support that is just a no brainer to a game like this... and so here we are.
     
  28. salvaribeiro Apprentice Engineer

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    303
    I've recently started playing again more than 2 years away from the game. I like how logistics on survival goes on planets. But, just as before when I played the game often, the excitement only goes as far as I try to get a little more from their features. I built a small drone to scout the surface and while flying it around I wondered how cool would be to pilot it with a real RC radio. Only after going though all the trouble of making my PC identify a radio as a game controller I discovered SE does not have the option to control vertical thrust with an analog input.

    I'll not rant about about basic features missing, I'm just very sad because I used to be really excited about this game. I still think it does have a lot of potential but right now it feels like it will never be more than that. Potential. As a building simulator game SE seems being developed as a poor shooter. It does have awesome features. Planets for instance are something I didn't imagined KSE could pull off. And after a lot of development it's quite stable. But I can't stand seeing something as basic as the lack of analog vertical thrust. The saddest thing is this seems almost like it's a designed flaw. The game DOES have analog thrust for X and Y axis straffing plus X, Y and Z axis rotation, but the Z straffing, the most important axis for flying in planets, is mapped for tool activation. How can someone do an incredible job developing a whole planetary system simulation and not add a simple analog control for vertical thrust, the most important control to fly on planetary gravity? It's like building a car and letting a wheel missing because just 3 wheels are ok to drive. I understand developing software is tough, but this is just lame.
    --- Automerge ---
    I fiddled with the source code thinking maybe I could recompile and change a file that deals with controller input but apparently that part that deals with it is built into the core wich means it will be outdated and not work with my saves as the source available is pretty old. I did find something interesting though:

    MyControllerHelper.AddControl(CX_CHARACTER, MyControlsSpace.PRIMARY_TOOL_ACTION, MyJoystickAxesEnum.Zneg);
    MyControllerHelper.AddControl(CX_CHARACTER, MyControlsSpace.SECONDARY_TOOL_ACTION, MyJoystickAxesEnum.Zpos);
    MyControllerHelper.AddControl(CX_CHARACTER, MyControlsSpace.PRIMARY_BUILD_ACTION, MyJoystickAxesEnum.Zneg); // MW:TODO shouldn't be this way I think
    MyControllerHelper.AddControl(CX_CHARACTER, MyControlsSpace.SECONDARY_BUILD_ACTION, MyJoystickAxesEnum.Zpos); // this too
    MyControllerHelper.AddControl(CX_CHARACTER, MyControlsSpace.COPY_PASTE_ACTION, MyJoystickAxesEnum.Zneg); // this too

    This is on Sandbox.Game/Engine/Utils/MySpaceBindingCreator.cs (sorry I don't know how to format code snippets). If you check the comments on the code you'll see someone wrote that the axis I mentioned shouldn't work that way. The last time this file was updated was 2 YEARS AGO.

    GUYS

    PLEASE

    If you have a few minutes on your busy development schedule, please change those 5 lines on your next update so they work like they should for movement. A lot of fans from this game will appreciate.
     
  29. Sea_Kerman Trainee Engineer

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  30. Forcedminer Senior Engineer

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    2,227
    Heh....a basic enough feature players have wanted and posted about for 4 years.

    the silence is deafening
     
Thread Status:
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