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Lighting sensor, Sensor resistor, Pressure sensor, logic gates...

Discussion in 'General' started by flight engineer Green, Jul 29, 2020 at 13:14.


Do you want to enter the specified items in the game?

  1. Yes

    2 vote(s)
  2. No

    1 vote(s)
  1. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    Instilling programming skills in players is a good thing, but where is mechanical engineering? Why can't a player create alternative mechanical-electronic circuits to programming? The game has a Timer, but there are no logical ventels. Of course, it is possible to pervert using control panels and the like, but it is as abysmal as using an Oxygen truss or Solar panel as a lighting sensor using C # scripts. ;)

    When will Space Engineers have an illumination sensor? Forcing players to use programming and tricks in the form of an oxygen farm or solar panel together with C # scripts is of course resourceful, but extremely cruel.
    Also in the game I would like to have logic gates such as: AND, OR, NOT, NAND, NOR, XOR, XNOR
    and also mathematical blocks: +, - , * , /. Also a block in which you can specify a numeric value.
    Where's the Sensor Resistor? Players could build interesting things using a touch resistor. For example, by creating a circuit from a sensor resistor that would record the pressure of any object indicated on it under the influence of gravity (artificial, planetary) or in connection with the presence of an object on it. It would be possible to automate mechanically processes such as the start of reverse engines or the activation of other elements (pistons, rotors, etc.).
    I am not talking now about the Motion Sensor, which is already in the game (for those who did not understand).
    This would really be engineering to the full.

    A Gas pressure sensors is also needed. I understand that you can use "Air Vent" as a pressure sensor and navigate the readings that are displayed on "Air Vent", but you know - it is somewhat stupid, from an engineering point of view, to put a fragment of the ventilation system, namely "Air Vent", to understand whether there is air in any compartment or not. Why would the player use C # programming to automate the closure of the compartment doors if depressurization occurs, for example? A pressure sensor is quite a mechanical thing in real life. In the game having such a sensor, the player setting critical, for example, one of the four pressure levels in its properties (suppose it reacts as much as "Air Vent") could simply connect to the door and in the case of a pressure reduction ( Oxygen or hydrogen based on game mechanics) in the room lock the door or turn on the ventilation for air injection or vice versa start for pumping, etc. Why is this not in the game in which design is stated in the foreground? By the way, a gas pressure sensor is definitely necessary for detecting hydrogen in a room. For example, a player has destroyed several hydrogen storage facilities in a room and an urgent need to block the compartment.

    Please implement these things in the game. Players need them to enjoy really designing, not just programming. :tu::)
    N.B. Forgive my bad English language
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2020 at 11:22
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    So many things needed. I still don't have a popcorn machine. And I still can't take off my spacesuit to poop. When will Keen finally give me what I want!?!
    • Funny Funny x 1
  3. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    Your irony is inappropriate.
    I have enough programming at work.
    The "popcorn machine" in the game is in the form of the DLC "Decorative Pack." There's even a toilet. In the last DLC dancing disco engineers added. Everything is there, but specifically I do not see deep engineering for my money spent. Most of all, it upsets me that the "Gamecraft" that I got for free (as a participant in pre-alpha testing) in some mechanics is superior to the previously bought "Space Engineers." ;)
    I mean, if the game says that it allows for wide and deep engineering, then it should have appropriate mechanisms. Yes, Space Engineers are good, but without some things, the game looks incomplete. This looks now like a designer of a car model and at the same time it does not have for example parts "steering wheel," "transmission," but there are many stickers on the body, and headlights of different colors and shades. :D
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020 at 19:24
  4. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    Prepare yourself for disappointment then. My point is that many, many people come to this game believing it should be the way they envision it should be, and everybody's individual vision is different. Make your request(s) the support site and see what happens.
    --- Automerge ---

    As a real-life engineer for many years, I have learned to work with the tools provided to me, whether it be specific hardware I can use, analysis and/or design software I can use, or whatever. I sometimes request new tools because I see a benefit in their use, but more often than not my requests are denied for various reasons (mostly budgetary). So I've learned to work with the tools available to me to the best of my ability. Sure, I'd love one of those really spiffy 3-D printers for prototyping my designs, but that simply isn't going to happen. Not today, but maybe tomorrow, so I occasionally ask again.

    My point is that the game is what the game is, and as in real life we don't always get everything we'd like. So learn to work with what you've got. It's amazing what you can do with a little planning and innovation.

    OK. That's all I'm going to say about that.
    • Like Like x 1
  5. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    I understand everything very well, but I have to admit that, frankly, I am infuriated by the lack of the ability to create a full-fledged analog system. Programming in life, programming in the game is too much. I still remember Colobot and programming engineering calculators like МК-61. The last time I started a game was when it was version 187 or 188 (family, children, work) and what was my disappointment... to code for elementary things... Lord! Well, why is there a Timer and there is no normal logical ventel and there are no analog elements of the simplest mathematical operations. My child has already assembled his own analog calculator at Gamecraft, and I in Space Engineers must program for this on C #...

    --- Automerge ---
    Do you know what this looks like about the game situation?
    - Boy want to play in the sandbox?
    - Yes!
    - Give me $15
    - Take...

    Regarding engineering work in reality. Is your company so greedy that even the digitizer did not acquire for the design technologist? Horror...
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020 at 22:15
  6. ShadedMJ Apprentice Engineer

  7. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    Thanks for pointing out the links. I registered and supported both topics. :tu:
    But I see no reason to attack me with any claims.
    I got the game long enough. But I have a family, work and I do not devote much time to the project. So it's no surprise I didn't find these topics. What's my fault? I can't understand.
    My proposal is quite independent and natural that it is similar to the proposals of other people since it is quite logical that there should be these elements in the designer and many people understand this. I went to the forum. I entered the search query "lighting sensor" and did not find a similar topic. Since I didn't find it, I created it. What is the essence of the claim against me?
    I understand my fault is that I didn't write in technical support?
    And why should I write offers in technical support? The main task of this unit is to respond to reports of breakdowns, and not to receive offers from players. A forum has been established for this purpose. :?
  8. ShadedMJ Apprentice Engineer

    That was my "not sounding mean" text (3 flippin' sentences) and I think you are misinterpreting a lot and blowing it out of proportion.

    as such...

    I kind of object to the poll concept, which is why I asked why there is a poll there. My opinion is its a silly poll, because of course most players _want_ those things added to the game. I admit I would like those added as well, and I'm a programmer.

    For logic blocks : But if I were a developer, I'd probably say NO right off the bat or at least need to think about it for a good long time. It raises questions like how often the logic blocks need updating and there's always going to be players wanting the updates faster to the point where it is less Space Engineers and more Logic Block Simulator. Also there is no event system, so there is going to be a lot of players that will then want non-stop updates from blocks to feed the logic system, but most blocks don't say what their status would be. Its a giant can of worms that I can see developers wanting to avoid completely. I check now and it doesn't look like anyone made a mod for logic blocks, which I would think there should be many mods by now.
  9. Spaceman Spiff Senior Engineer

    Your logic is impeccable.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. KissSh0t Master Engineer

    I can think of some uses for a light sensor... that would be pretty cool.
    • Like Like x 1
  11. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    Machine translation problem :D
    Did I get the translation right? Do you claim that if logical valves appear in the game, then this will cause serious problems?

    Since I have no other similar alternative, I will take a close game in terms of mechanics. My son, who is eight years old, plays it. By the way, I asked him to create something in the game with logical valves and hinges.
    Okay, okay, I really told him something. I told him about multiplying by -1 ;)
    Now my child in the second grade knows about Cartesian coordinates and knows how to mathematically operate with negative numbers:carlton:

    Now let's try to solve a similar problem in Space Engineers. Just don't cheat! No scripts! :woot:

    Imagine two suitcases with locksmiths. In one of the suitcases there are screwdrivers and wrenches, and in the second suitcase there are only wrenches and there is still a machine for cutting threads. Space Engineers is the second suitcase. 2020-2013 = 7 years. After 7 years, the game, in which engineering is part of the gameplay, finally appeared hinges...:pbjt:
    And you know, what makes it even more upsetting that Gamecraft is made by indie developers. Thus, it cannot be said that Gamecraft developers have more opportunities...
    Regarding the "can with worms." By programming the C # script, you can contribute significantly more errors and problems. :)
    --- Automerge ---
    I looked at the API and I can immediately say why no one in 7 years has made a lighting sensor.
    Based on the available APIs, it will first be necessary to add all the found sources of artificial lighting to the data array. Then, by going through an array of artificial lighting sources, find out from them the type of attenuation and, of course, the brightness, as well as the radius of lighting. Besides that, I never found anything in the API to do with lighting (property - illumination?..Difficult to explain through a translator...). So everything that I say above will still have to be linked to the available functionality of the motion sensor. The point will be that. We have a sensor, from it to calculate the coordinates to the object and calculate its normal relative to the light source that is in the array. Anyway, that nonsense.
    Natural lighting has a separate class and the easiest way is to use the code of solar panels or an oxygen farm to create a natural lighting sensor.
    As a result, we will have two sensors in fashion. One for natural lighting, the other for artificial lighting (Of course, it is possible to plug in one sensor, but then it will be necessary to multiply the obtained brightness from a natural source by the brightness from an artificial one). By the way, there is no point in sensors of special importance without logical ventels, except as a direct reaction to an event. In any case, even if there were a lighting sensor, players would have to write the C # script again for more less adequate automation, rather than a simple on/off response to an object.
    I am very sorry that in Space Engineers such a trouble with logic...:(
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2020 at 13:20
  12. May Rears Apprentice Engineer

    Space Enginners cannot handle the physics object calculations for just rotors and pistons in multiplayer, it is also why vanilla ore detectors are such a short range and you want to add even more calculations?

    A reasonable sized ship build can soon hit 10 or more vents if you want the ability to have interior spaces seal in the event of a hull breach in one area. Now multiply that by 16 or more for a server.

    If you are wanting that level of complexity in your builds and are just after the challenge of completing that build then check out Stationeers. I'd love to have that level of complexity in SE but it simply wont work. SE2 if they ever make it, maybe.
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  13. KissSh0t Master Engineer

    Remember the olden days of being told the Hing block was impossible to implement... haha.. yeah.. good times.
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  14. KPTECH Trainee Engineer

    If it really is such a big hit to processing, then they can allow it to be disabled in the world options menu. I can see the business issues for working on a feature that potentially a lot of people will leave disabled to save processing power, but a lot of people don't use meteors or pressurization. One of the special things about space engineers is the vast world customization options. Gees, there are probably a lot of people like me out there who never even play on planets.

    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    Are you joking right now? Based on the fact that you wrote it turns out that both scripts and modifications in the multiplayer should be prohibited since they heavily load the processor (mathematical calculations on the processor side are performed).
    If you look objectively, then no one prevents the server owner from limiting the available number of CPU. I think you should not justify the absence of elementary blocks of design by flights from the server and supposedly a large load on the server. From your words it turns out that if suddenly a ship with two logical ventels flew to the server instead of ten timers, armageddon would come. [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Yes, it really was such stupid statements that I was even tired of laughing. [​IMG]

    I agree. This is a possible solution for those with a mediocre computer. [​IMG]
  16. TheHellKat Trainee Engineer

    Additional sensor types, or at least additional sensor options is something I'd love to see, the depressurisation sensor is technically in the game already as previously noted, so adding that functionality to the sensor block shouldn't be an issue to either coding it into the game or be a performance issue (as it already exists).

    Logic gates is a big ball of no from me. It would be nice but it's such a neich item, plus it doesn't really fit into the SE style. Logic gates and the things you do with them quickly become complicated and in SE complicated means big.

    Can you imagine having a space ship with a logic gate bigger than the ship? It's stupid, especially when such things are better controlled through programming.

    Functionality is good, complication is bad. Just ask any engineer about the KISS principle.
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  17. flight engineer Green Trainee Engineer

    There is rational grain in your words.
    However, I can assume that nothing prevents you from doing something like a nod system in a game using logical ventels. Although I personally believe that logical gates, even if they were made the size of one cube (like a Timer), when used, the occupied volume would be less than when players avoiding programming on C # use Timers for automation. :D
  18. TheHellKat Trainee Engineer

    True, but timers don't require direct connection that logic gated circuits do.
    If you want logic gates without direct connections then you need to use programmable blocks, which makes the logic gates redundant.
  19. KPTECH Trainee Engineer

    Why would logic gates need to be connected?
  20. mojomann71 Senior Engineer

    The Easy Automation Script 2.0 gives you the option to use some of the Logic Gate function if I remember correctly.